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  • #6,401
  • Jan 22, 2015 5:40pm Jan 22, 2015 5:40pm
http://forexmagnates.com/forex-lever...d-hike-margin/
Chasing The Dream...
  • #6,402
  • Jan 22, 2015 6:17pm Jan 22, 2015 6:17pm
Quoting Ribo
Well in all fairness, the spike in the bid price cut through my stop loss but the position was kept open - so it must have been an error in the price feed, that did not effect order execution (only judging from my own case).
Thanks for pointing this out, Ribo

Quoting Bilstein
I've been using FXCM's NDD/STP model for nearly 6 years now and all of the sudden, 100-point spikes popping up on my data feed but not on others? I've actually never seen it like this before, did FXCM suddenly get THAT desperate they're running stops this obviously now? I have two choices, find another broker or wait until FXCM can stop being desperate and get back to business as usual. I'm sorry, but 100+ point spikes on a 1M chart is not business as usual in my 6 years on this account.
Hi Bilstein,

Thanks you for being a client of FXCM for nearly 6 years. We offer you the same No Dealing Desk (NDD) forex execution as before. That means unlike with a dealing desk broker, FXCM does not make money when you lose on a trade. If you or anyone else had live trades that were negatively impacted by the spikes you mentioned, I encourage you to use this form to file a trade inquiry so the Trade Services Team can investigate what happened and follow up with you: http://bit.ly/1bPwxzZ
  • #6,403
  • Jan 22, 2015 6:23pm Jan 22, 2015 6:23pm
Jason, I can't lie man, seeing that 100 point spike across three pairs on FXCM data feed but not others makes me leery. I've seen the MT Administrator and Virtual Dealer Plug-in in action and that unexplained price spike (no news events or announcements) scream broker-injected prices. I concede that I could be wrong, maybe it was a hiccup in the data feed but it's still a little concerning.
  • #6,404
  • Jan 22, 2015 6:54pm Jan 22, 2015 6:54pm
I get mail from fxcm,anybody else get???

what to do? tey said no -0 balance on site???


Dear Client,
IMPORTANT NEWS REGARDING YOUR FXCM TRADING ACCOUNTS

Please be advised that in order to offset negative balances you currently hold in your FXCM account(s), FXCM has transferred funds from your account(s) with a positive balance. The terms of your master trading agreement entered into with FXCM, available online, provide FXCM with these rights.
If after this transfer you still maintain a negative balance on your account, you are requested to remit funds immediately. FXCM accepts deposits by, debit card, bank wire and ACH electronic check. All options can be accessed via our www.myfxcm.com portal.
As you may already be aware, last week, the Swiss National Bank (“SNB”) announced that they will no longer support a self-imposed floor on the EUR/CHF exchange rate. Learn More
The SNB announcement, extreme price movements and the resulting lack of liquidity were exceptional and unprecedented events causing many market participants to incur trading losses. These events were unforeseen and beyond the control of FXCM, constituting force majeure events.
Record of this transaction is available by generating a Combined Account Statement and referencing the description “Offset Transfer from Account to Account for Negative Balance”.
FXCM thanks you for you cooperation and understanding.

If you have any questions please contact one of our FXCM specialists, who are available 24 hours a day, by live chat, by calling 0808 234 8789 (free phone), or by e-mail at [email protected].
FXCM hereby reserves all rights and remedies that it may have at law, in equity, under the terms of any contracts with you. Nothing in this notice shall be deemed to constitute a waiver or settlement of any of FXCM’s rights and remedies.
Remember forex and CFD trading can result in a loss of some or all of your deposited funds and therefore may not be suitable for everyone, so please ensure that you fully understand the risks involved.
  • #6,405
  • Jan 22, 2015 7:00pm Jan 22, 2015 7:00pm
don't know if these points have been covered by the previous posts. the consensus here is that fxcm is not entitled to collect money from customers. the following paragraphs might be a cold shower for some of you:


1) statement from the agreement signed between fxcm and leucadia:


Quote
The credit agreement requires monthly payments of the term loan from proceeds received during the immediately preceding calendar month from accounts receivable related to the customer debit balances referenced above


2) paragraph from the "legal term and agreement" (we all have signed it):


Quote
As a condition of your use of the FXCM Sites, you agree to indemnify and hold FXCM and its Third Party Content providers harmless from and against any and all claims, losses, liability, costs and expenses (including but not limited to attorneys’ fees) arising from your use of the FXCM Sites, or from your violation of these Terms


3) trader agreement under the "fxcm consent form":


Quote
In the event that FXCM’s liquidity providers are unable to provide such liquidity, then Trader may also lose access to streaming prices and be unable to place trades during this time. When such liquidity lapses occur, Trader agrees to indemnify FXCM for any and all losses that may occur due to said volatility and/or movement in the market.


don't play with fire and believe in fairy tales. you lost money, this is the reality, over your head.
thinking that fxcm is some kind of santa or worse, blaming them for coming after you, is useless.
find a lawyer. and better a good one! cause you'll pay some of it back!


p.s. i may sound stupid, but i'm all for fxcm getting back some of their losses. i know they were front running clients, but the last 2 years or so showed fxcm to be a better broker, a better business. now they are edged to extinction because of customers complacent about their risks and really good at double-thinking (e.g. i can't lose more than i had, but fxcm can).


i withdrew 95% of my account. still wait it to hit my bank account.
i'll trade with fxcm this 5% of my fx capital. and i'll deposit more if there's any news about them collecting (their) money.
fxcm, bring the sexy back!
  • #6,406
  • Jan 22, 2015 7:31pm Jan 22, 2015 7:31pm
If you have a negative balance you may want to save this page http://support.fxcm.com/fxts/user-guide/margin/

Is there a debit balance risk? Can I lose more money than I deposit?
Not with FXCM. It is FXCMâ€s policy to credit accounts to a zero balance when debit balances occur as a result of trading. One of the greatest concerns traders have about leverage is that a sizable loss could result in owing money to their broker. At FXCM, your maximum risk of loss is limited by the amount in your account. All accounts are tracked by our “Margin Watcher” feature. With the Margin Watcher feature, if account equity falls below margin requirements, the FXCM Trading Station will trigger an order to close all or some open positions.
  • #6,407
  • Edited 9:17pm Jan 22, 2015 7:32pm | Edited 9:17pm
Quoting Chiang124
I get mail from fxcm,anybody else get???

what to do? tey said no -0 balance on site???

Dear Client,
IMPORTANT NEWS REGARDING YOUR FXCM TRADING ACCOUNTS

Please be advised that in order to offset negative balances you currently hold in your FXCM account(s), FXCM has transferred funds from your account(s) with a positive balance. The terms of your master trading agreement entered into with FXCM, available online, provide FXCM with these rights.
If after this transfer you still maintain a negative balance on your account, you are requested to remit funds immediately. FXCM accepts deposits by, debit card, bank wire and ACH electronic check. All options can be accessed via our www.myfxcm.com portal.
As you may already be aware, last week, the Swiss National Bank (“SNB”) announced that they will no longer support a self-imposed floor on the EUR/CHF exchange rate. Learn More
The SNB announcement, extreme price movements and the resulting lack of liquidity were exceptional and unprecedented events causing many market participants to incur trading losses. These events were unforeseen and beyond the control of FXCM, constituting force majeure events.
Record of this transaction is available by generating a Combined Account Statement and referencing the description “Offset Transfer from Account to Account for Negative Balance”.
FXCM thanks you for you cooperation and understanding.

If you have any questions please contact one of our FXCM specialists, who are available 24 hours a day, by live chat, by calling 0808 234 8789 (free phone), or by e-mail at [email protected].
FXCM hereby reserves all rights and remedies that it may have at law, in equity, under the terms of any contracts with you. Nothing in this notice shall be deemed to constitute a waiver or settlement of any of FXCM’s rights and remedies.
Remember forex and CFD trading can result in a loss of some or all of your deposited funds and therefore may not be suitable for everyone, so please ensure that you fully understand the risks involved.
WOW - YES. About time. Now the shit will start flying.

Thanks for posting Chiang, but really sorry about your position.

cheers scalpz

Quoting hatzius
... 1)... 2)... 3)...
edit: Good researching there hatzius
guess that spells out the layout, level and clearly. Well done.
p.s. not sounding stupid at all - sounding trader.
Target 2 : Stoploss in the green
  • #6,408
  • Jan 22, 2015 7:34pm Jan 22, 2015 7:34pm
Quoting Bilstein
I've been using FXCM's NDD/STP model for nearly 6 years now and all of the sudden, 100-point spikes popping up on my data feed but not on others? I've actually never seen it like this before, did FXCM suddenly get THAT desperate they're running stops this obviously now? I have two choices, find another broker or wait until FXCM can stop being desperate and get back to business as usual. I'm sorry, but 100+ point spikes on a 1M chart is not business as usual in my 6 years on this account.
This maybe because some of their LP's have pulled the pin.
Noticeable slippage now
  • #6,409
  • Jan 22, 2015 8:19pm Jan 22, 2015 8:19pm
Ok; its getting interesting now! No surprise FXCM used the only clause that they think might apply.

In reality, every corporation has a " force majeure event" clause but that implies to an event relating to an unforeseen Act of God or the like; not poor risk management! Why would a "force majeure event" only apply to FXCM and not to any of the other brokers that incidentally, zeroed accounts even though they may not have had a no debit policy such as FXCM? What judge would agree with that?

Good luck to all attorneys that will have a field day with this one. It seems that FXCM just made their matters a lot worse. Lets see how the shareholders respond in the market tomorrow.
  • #6,410
  • Jan 22, 2015 8:21pm Jan 22, 2015 8:21pm
Quoting Jason Rogers
{quote} Hi Deskpro, I know you have been waiting for feedback and I thank you for your patience. As mentioned previously our audit team is handling any account inquiries. We're working on a solution, but I don't have any further information at this point. I'll let you know once I do. Jason
Dear Jason.May I know any news from fxcm about the negative balance on UK account ?
  • #6,411
  • Jan 22, 2015 8:32pm Jan 22, 2015 8:32pm
For the last few years I have worked hard to save up my money and put countless hours into studying and testing strategies and finally decided to dive in to trading full time at the first of 2015. Great timing! LoL! For all intensive purposes I am still a "newbie".

I decided to make FXCM my broker because they seemed to be the best choice here in the US to pick. Grant it...we don't have many choices here. Then all this mess happened last week and while I did not personally have any losses and FXCM has sent me my money that was in my account (I pulled it all out just to be safe for now) I am so confused as to what to do. My heart goes out to everyone that got wiped out with this mess.

I had decided up until today I was going to stick with FXCM and give them a chance but it just seems like one thing after another keeps popping up that is making me seriously have doubts. Now it appears they are going after everyone who has negative account balances when they supposedly advertised that they would never do that. But what broker is there to switch to? I find a lot of bad reviews on just about every broker we have to pick from. I'm ready to start my dream of making my living from trading and I don't know what broker to trust. I am definitely going to use multiple brokers and not trust all my money to just one but I don't know which ones to pick.

I would appreciate anyone that could give me some guidance.
  • #6,412
  • Jan 22, 2015 8:34pm Jan 22, 2015 8:34pm
That's at the bottom of the email that @chiang124 received:


Remember forex and CFD trading can result in a loss of some or all of your deposited funds and therefore may not be suitable for everyone, so please ensure that you fully understand the risks involved.


Even now they are NOT saying LOSSES CAN EXCEED DEPOSITS. Another thing, @chiang is using FXCM UK, anybody knows if US based traders are getting these emails?
  • #6,413
  • Jan 22, 2015 8:40pm Jan 22, 2015 8:40pm
Quoting jmullins9646
For the last few years I have worked hard to ...

I'd go with Oanda. They are legit, have been around a long time, don't seem to play any games with clients, and as of the last few years have had a stable platform.
  • #6,414
  • Jan 22, 2015 8:59pm Jan 22, 2015 8:59pm
Quoting jmullins9646
For the last few years I have worked hard to save up my money and put countless hours into studying and testing strategies and finally decided to dive in to trading full time at the first of 2015. Great timing! LoL! For all intensive purposes I am still a "newbie". I decided to make FXCM my broker because they seemed to be the best choice here in the US to pick. Grant it...we don't have many choices here. Then all this mess happened last week and while I did not personally have any losses and FXCM has sent me my money that was in my account (I pulled...
Don't trade with a US based broker. If Oanda is the best option, then, Houston, we have a problem. There are still brokers around that will accept US residents and offer much better trading conditions. The regulations have actually accomplished what they intended-how many brokers have left the US market in the past 2-3 years? The NFA really doesn't want retail forex to exist in this country. It's all for their own benefit, though, don't believe the bullshit about protecting the trader. They want us to deposit more money now to cover margin with brokers who THEY WILL NOT ALLOW TO SEGREGATE OUR ACCOUNTS. It's not the brokers, it's the NFA that doesn't permit it. It's so ironic that when it comes to freedom- THE LAND OF THE FREE sucks.
  • #6,415
  • Jan 22, 2015 9:11pm Jan 22, 2015 9:11pm
Taken from the legal dictionary: http://legal-dictionary.thefreedicti.../Force+Majeure

Force Majeure
[French, A superior or irresistible power.] An event that is a result of the elements of nature, as opposed to one caused by human behavior.
The term force majeure relates to the law of insurance and is frequently used in construction contracts to protect the parties in the event that a segment of the contract cannot be performed due to causes that are outside the control of the parties, such as natural disasters, that could not be evaded through the exercise of due care.

A court ruling will be necessary to identify the SNB event as a "Force Majeure". So unlikely for anyone to see this event as one equivalent to a natural disaster!
  • #6,416
  • Jan 22, 2015 9:13pm Jan 22, 2015 9:13pm
Quoting Chiang124
If after this transfer you still maintain a negative balance on your account, you are requested to remit funds immediately.
They request me add funds???not I must add funds???
  • #6,417
  • Edited 9:36pm Jan 22, 2015 9:26pm | Edited 9:36pm
Quoting euler123
Taken from the legal dictionary: http://legal-dictionary.thefreedicti.../Force+Majeure Force Majeure [French, A superior or irresistible power.] An event that is a result of the elements of nature, as opposed to one caused by human behavior. The term force majeure relates to the law of insurance and is frequently used in construction contracts to protect the parties in the event that a segment of the contract cannot be performed due to causes that are outside the control of the parties, such as natural disasters, that could not...
euler, thanks for everything you wrote. force majeure, even if it's a 30 standard deviation, like a tsunami, means to prove somehow that a central bank did something wrong (other cases were terrorist attacks, natural disasters, etc).
but what we've got here?
a) clients having a real proof that fxcm obligated itself to stand for losses greater than their account.
b) fxcm having multiple contractual agreements that clients cannot harm the company through their market actions.

reality is gray from now on. nobody wins, that's quite sure. but that's quite bad for clients. sorry for them, yet it is what it is. i'm not smarter than anyone here - it could have happened to me by the way; only that i couldn't have lost multiples of my account based on my risk management approach. anyway, it doesn't matter.
other brokers forgave negative balances. ok, but how much did they lose?most of them will make it back.
fxcm, on the other hand, is forced into bankruptcy.

what's their business right now? making <7 mil in profits and paying back 300 mil or collecting a good percentage of the 225 mil and pay back leucadia and stay in business? for me it's an obvious answer.

don't delude yourselves into thinking that fxcm is here for you to trade (with or without spikes like those posted above). no, they are here to collect their debt. otherwise, they are bankrupt.
  • #6,418
  • Jan 22, 2015 9:27pm Jan 22, 2015 9:27pm
Quoting euler123
Taken from the legal dictionary: http://legal-dictionary.thefreedicti.../Force+Majeure Force Majeure [French, A superior or irresistible power.] An event that is a result of the elements of nature, as opposed to one caused by human behavior. The term force majeure relates to the law of insurance and is frequently used in construction contracts to protect the parties in the event that a segment of the contract cannot be performed due to causes that are outside the control of the parties, such as natural disasters, that could not...
Agreed, as Dukascopy saw this as a risk 3 months ago and acted, so it is really just a risk management issue, not Force Majeure.

Quote
Reduction of maximum leverage on EUR/CHF exposures 03 October 2014
Due to the possibility of a break of the 1.2000 floor in EUR/CHF which may see significant price gaps and cause negative equity on client accounts, Dukascopy Europe is forced to implement a maximum leverage for EURCHF exposures of 1:10 as of 12 October 2014.

Traders trading EURCHF are invited to estimate margin usage at the moment the maximum leverage on EUR/CHF will be reduced and adjust their exposure accordingly if needed.

For DEMO accounts the new...
  • #6,419
  • Edited 10:41pm Jan 22, 2015 9:38pm | Edited 10:41pm
Quoting euler123
Taken from the legal dictionary: http://legal-dictionary.thefreedicti.../Force+Majeure Force Majeure [French, A superior or irresistible power.] An event that is a result of the elements of nature, as opposed to one caused by human behavior. The term force majeure relates to the law of insurance and is frequently used in construction contracts to protect the parties in the event that a segment of the contract cannot be performed due to causes that are outside the control of the parties, such as natural disasters, that could not...
1. Has the force majeure clause been there prior to terms of business update on Jan 16, 2015?

2. It is rather shaky ground for FXCM to claim as that they acknowledged the event being force majeure, any trader can come and use it as excuse from settling their balance. Does FXCM indeed expect one sided force majeure protection?

3. Many will claim that the move is not force majeure, but simply larger than anyone could anticipate to otherwise a regular course of business event.

4. Also, in line with the previous item, nothing stops them in this situation from bringing negative account to zero. FM would be if something destroyed their data center rendering them unable to provide service and traders being unable to close their positions.

5. It will be also interesting to see if protection applies to individual accounts or all accounts with FXCM as the whole. How was it prior to the CHF event? It was still possible to go negative in one of accounts, but likely for very limited number of traders and for insignificant in relative terms amounts given that average gap may be 10-100 pips.

It does not look that FXCM will be collecting much (too many ifs) and probably it was wrong for them even to go that way from PR perspective.
  • #6,420
  • Jan 22, 2015 9:40pm Jan 22, 2015 9:40pm
Quoting Zappa
{quote} I'd go with Oanda. They are legit, have been around a long time, don't seem to play any games with clients, and as of the last few years have had a stable platform.
Lol, you must not have been around with these guys too much. I left Oanda because of their inane spread widening practices which were absolutely destroying some of my trades. The platform sucks, the service sucks, and while customer communication is okay, FXCM had improved with spreads to the point that tolerating Oanda's gimmicks wasn't worth it anymore.

I am disappointed to see that FXCM is asking for account holders to send in additional funds to cover negative balances, as I don't really think that vast majority of the retail customers had any idea this kind of liability or risk even existed. I do agree with the in-house confiscation of funds given how critical the situation is for the company. I'll be honest, I've been pretty happy with how FXCM has been run the last year. They've treated me as if they want my business. There have been huge improvements in performance to make them competitive, and I'd like to see their business continue. Maybe, however, it's time to start trading against the clients again to hedge for these kinds of losses. As long as there's no intentional corruption of trader positions to profit from their losses, any incidental winnings don't bother me. How does FXCM profiting from some of my losses harm me if the money would have just gone to someone else anyway?
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