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What was your "holy grail"?

  • #181
  • Edited 2:26pm Feb 6, 2018 12:00am | Edited 2:26pm
Hey guys.

So I am currently working on my resume to hand into potential employers... (being at university provides me a lot of awesome opportunities).

Of course, I want to include my trading endeavors! How would you go about listing "trading" or "forex" on your resume?
What skill sets would you consider writing down?

I have never created a resume before so I really don't know what is "too much" when it comes to listing attributes about myself.

Thanks! All the best.
  • #182
  • Feb 6, 2018 1:44am Feb 6, 2018 1:44am
Quoting Ganative
Hey guys. So I am currently working on my resume to hand into potential employers... (being at university provides me a lot of awesome opportunities). Of course, I want to include my trading endeavors! How would you go about listing "trading" or "forex" on your resume? What skill sets would you consider writing down? ... Would something like "able to competently perform detailed data analysis" be an okay statement to make? I have never created a resume before so I really don't know what is "too much" when it comes to listing attributes about myself....
Are you applying for a job at a bank?
"The fun is in the hunt. Not the kill."
  • #183
  • Edited 4:44am Feb 6, 2018 1:51am | Edited 4:44am
Tell them: Skilled in analyzing and forecasting Forex markets.

KP

Quoting Ganative
Hey guys. So I am currently working on my resume to hand into potential employers... (being at university provides me a lot of awesome opportunities). Of course, I want to include my trading endeavors! How would you go about listing "trading" or "forex" on your resume? What skill sets would you consider writing down? ... Would something like "able to competently perform detailed data analysis" be an okay statement to make? I have never created a resume before so I really don't know what is "too much" when it comes to listing attributes about myself....
Do your homework, follow the footprints of smart money
  • #184
  • Feb 6, 2018 4:21am Feb 6, 2018 4:21am
Prior to my son's delivery they put my wife into NST (Non Stress Test) , measuring the heart beat of the baby for 20 mins and recording on a paper. I was reading that like a chart and telling my wife everything seem to be good. Our doctor was suprised. So I guess if you can read a chart in FX you can read any kind of chart . Chart reading should be on a resume.
  • #185
  • Feb 6, 2018 4:49am Feb 6, 2018 4:49am
Quoting Kxeroo
Prior to my son's delivery they put my wife into NST (Non Stress Test) , measuring the heart beat of the baby for 20 mins and recording on a paper. I was reading that like a chart and telling my wife everything seem to be good. Our doctor was suprised. So I guess if you can read a chart in FX you can read any kind of chart . Chart reading should be on a resume.
No doubt on your opinion! Because, I am also doing my live trading based on the chart reading! Before I used only candle pattern but now I am working on the whole chart; it’s really awesome.
  • #186
  • Feb 6, 2018 7:43am Feb 6, 2018 7:43am
Quoting Ganative
Hey guys. So I am currently working on my resume to hand into potential employers... (being at university provides me a lot of awesome opportunities). Of course, I want to include my trading endeavors! How would you go about listing "trading" or "forex" on your resume? What skill sets would you consider writing down? ... Would something like "able to competently perform detailed data analysis" be an okay statement to make? I have never created a resume before so I really don't know what is "too much" when it comes to listing attributes about myself....
I think to make it worth mentioning, it should be put in terms like: "I have spent time studying forex markets and developing analysis skills." Then maybe "I believe I have some useful skills..." and so on. Otherwise it could be just a statement which is your opinion, like "I am a great tennis player". That is just my opinion, having read several resumes, interviewed a few people. Take it or leave it. I hope you do well.
Gone to a better place
  • #187
  • Edited 10:09am Feb 6, 2018 9:28am | Edited 10:09am
Quoting Redeflect
{quote} Are you applying for a job at a bank?
Hey Redeflect, good to talk to you again.

Hmmm, no. Getting a job at a bank sounds really awesome but that’s not my ultimate goal. Maybe I’ll reach that point someday? It’s more competetive for me since I’m not Ivy League.

So, I am dual majoring in Finance and Risk Management & Insurance. I recently reached out to a professor of mine who is the head of the Risk Management department at my university, he was the one who inspired me to get a second degree (initially I was just majoring in finance)... besides from this forum, I felt like I needed to tell somebody about my trading journey. He was the only person I could think of who really understands the term risk. I felt like I could maybe get somewhere with the skill set I have now...

I set up an appointment with him to chat. And I went at it, told him how I am a “trader” and how much that word makes me cringe because of course everybody and their mother claim they know how to trade. I try not to use the word “trader” too much because it’s just so loosely thrown around.

But anyways, I told him that to actually be able to profit in the foreign exchange market, it’s all about analyzing RISK and PROBABILITY.

He stopped me there and said, “wow, you know what you’re talking about. See, I’m in insurance. You know that. But when people hear the word ‘insurance’ they get scared but why? It’s SUCH a lucrative field.”

My professor then asked me, “do you know what premiums are? Premiums are basically just profits for an insurance company. All that revenue coming from people paying premiums, of course we need to generate more money so the insurance company will usually invest that money... guys like you would come in and analyze the potential risk and MITIGATE that possible risk to a minimal.”

I thought that was crazy. Wow, isn’t that what forex is all about? I felt really stupid for not realizing how much being able to do efficient charting could relate to a HUGE variety of different career fields. Now that was something I didn’t know. I felt like it was a common knowledge or something and my mouth dropped. I had no idea insurance companies did that?

Sorry for the long post but I guess my story was meant to tell you that I’m trying to push for whatever FIRST internship/co-op opportunity there is... once that first internship comes around, it’ll make it that much easier to look for future employment in the industry I’m interested in (whether that be investment banking, insurance, whatever). I just need to build my resume and we’ll see wherever that takes me? Just like how money buys choices... a good resume buys opportunities, right?
  • #188
  • Edited 9:46am Feb 6, 2018 9:32am | Edited 9:46am
Quoting Kxeroo
Prior to my son's delivery they put my wife into NST (Non Stress Test) , measuring the heart beat of the baby for 20 mins and recording on a paper. I was reading that like a chart and telling my wife everything seem to be good. Our doctor was suprised. So I guess if you can read a chart in FX you can read any kind of chart . Chart reading should be on a resume.
Hi Kxeroo, thanks for sharing. That’s very interesting and I’m the same way. I find it so crazy how whenever I see a chart of any kind, I’m always analyzing it and thinking, “oh ya if this was a real chart, I’d be looking to sell right here at this point or looking to buy right here at this point.”

I am a pure technical analyst... you pull up a chart to me and NOT tell me the name of the market I’m looking at, and I can tell you at which points I’d be wanting to enter my trades and where I want to exit my trades. Being able to read charts IS really a skill. I think it’s actually beautiful how charts just make sense.
  • #189
  • Feb 6, 2018 9:36am Feb 6, 2018 9:36am
Quoting smikester
{quote} I think to make it worth mentioning, it should be put in terms like: "I have spent time studying forex markets and developing analysis skills." Then maybe "I believe I have some useful skills..." and so on. Otherwise it could be just a statement which is your opinion, like "I am a great tennis player". That is just my opinion, having read several resumes, interviewed a few people. Take it or leave it. I hope you do well.
Hi Smikester, thank you for sharing.

Theres one thing I learned from my peers. They told me to be confident in my resume and interviews but you DON’T want to sound cocky. When a person looking at my resume reads something along the lines of, “I’m a really great trader.” What weight does that hold at all? To him/her, I am probably just another clueless college kid who thinks he knows how to trade. A friend of mine who is an industrial engineer told me to try to be as humble as you can, and show confidence. But also AVOID trying to sound pretentious and cocky.
I guess I have to word my resume in a way that shows I know what I’m talking about, without sounding like a know-it-all.

What do you think?
  • #190
  • Feb 6, 2018 9:45am Feb 6, 2018 9:45am
Quoting Ganative
{quote} Hi Smikester, thank you for sharing. Theres one thing I learned from my peers. They told me to be confident in my resume and interviews but you DON’T want to sound cocky. When a person looking at my resume reads something along the lines of, “I’m a really great trader.” What weight does that hold at all? To him/her, I am probably just another clueless college kid who thinks he knows how to trade. A friend of mine who is an industrial engineer told me to try to be as humble as you can, and show confidence. But also AVOID trying to sound pretentious...
It depends, to some extent, on the type of employment you are seeking and the interviewer/s. There are different cultures in different businesses. Your friend is probably right. But, if you have put in a lot of hours in trading, definitely mention it. Good for you.
Gone to a better place
  • #191
  • Feb 6, 2018 9:57am Feb 6, 2018 9:57am
Quoting smikester
{quote} It depends, to some extent, on the type of employment you are seeking and the interviewer/s. There are different cultures in different businesses. Your friend is probably right. But, if you have put in a lot of hours in trading, definitely mention it. Good for you.
Thousands of hours brother.

Thanks for your input! I just feel like when it’s in the world of finance, lots of students my age have absolutely no idea what they are even talking about, so naturally interviewers are used to reading bullcrap. I guess it’s hard to sound genuine (not sure if that’s the word I want to use?) when there are so many phonies out there saying the same things on their resume and trying to take that same spot you’re trying to get. Interviewers are probably reading the same crap over and over again.
  • #192
  • Edited 11:11am Feb 6, 2018 10:11am | Edited 11:11am
Quoting Ganative
{quote} Hey Redeflect, good to talk to you again. Hmmm, no. Getting a job at a bank sounds really awesome but that’s not my ultimate goal. Maybe I’ll reach that point someday? It’s more competetive for me since I’m not Ivy League. So, I am dual majoring in Finance and Risk Management & Insurance. I recently reached out to a professor of mine who is the head of the Risk Management department at my university, he was the one who inspired me to get a second degree (initially I was just majoring in finance)... besides from this forum, I felt like I...
It's just 'undefined risk'. Something that's easy to classify but difficult to categorize. I thought you'd have already understood how insurance works; essentially a casino that doesn't appeal to the vices of the masses. Society does not teach how to identify risk. Even Actuaries have boring and tedious jobs these days where most of them just sit through the lectures but never truly appreciated the undefinable part(I know, I dated one for years out of highschool). Opportunities aren't bought. They're discovered. I wouldn't hire someone who has a great resume. I'd hire someone who has the right character. There are a lot of experienced and well educated individuals that just aren't at the next level. To get there; you have to discover what undefined risk is both for yourself and others.

Be aware; most employers don't care about character. They care about having their boots licked. You're going to have difficulty using trading on a resume with such people. It's beyond their level of appreciation.

Look for something you want. Then getting it will be easy. To what I understand of the industry a bank is not where you will want to end up. But, profitability and any experience with risk will look better in their eyes if you handled it well. You need to go around corporate HR and appeal directly to the professionals of the profession. For that you just need to know what they are looking for. In the case of trading; it really is a simple phrase of "profitable trading history available upon request". Your experience and level of integration in any field is more important than your ability to recall information that was spoon-fed to you. That's why college institutions are still churning out fools by the bucket-loads. Young adults tend not to know anything about risk.(I actually completely avoided college but I didn't realize at the time that I was taking a risk because.. I already knew I had whatever it was going to take and recognized my skills with integration)
"The fun is in the hunt. Not the kill."
  • #193
  • Edited 2:29pm Feb 6, 2018 11:07am | Edited 2:29pm
Quoting Redeflect
{quote} It's just 'undefined risk'. Something that's easy to classify but difficult to categorize. I thought you'd have already understood how insurance works; essentially a casino that doesn't appeal to the vices of the masses. Society does not teach how to identify risk. Even Actuaries have boring and tedious jobs these days where most of them just sit through the lectures but never truly appreciated the undefinable part(I know, I dated one for years out of highschool). Opportunities aren't bought. They're discovered. I wouldn't hire someone who...
No, I haven't the slightest clue what the insurance industry really did to generate profits. It wasn't until my professor explained to me about the concept of 'premiums' when it hit me.
Yes you are definitely right, society doesn't teach how to identify risk... this is something you can't learn in the classroom.

Right, I used that as an analogy. I don't mean actually 'buying' opportunities. I just meant an attractive resume will spark an interest within interviewers. Then, that's when you maximize on this chance (since you already got their attention) and show that you're not some robot, and that you have character and can quickly adapt to dynamic changes.

You're right about how opportunities aren't bought, they're discovered. BUT, to reach that point, you need leverage over other people. Meaning you need to have some sort of attractive resume to catch the attention of the interviewer. Many interviewers will glance at your resume, and if you don't have a specific requirement they're looking for (GPA, experience, education/degree) then they'll immediately toss your resume in the trash and continue looking for another person that has what they want.

"You're going to have difficulty using trading on a resume with such people. It's beyond their level of appreciation."
This I agree with, that’s very well put. Most people don't have the degree of appreciation for trading and don't really understand the underlying significance of the traits needed to actually profit in trading. This is why I asked you all what is the BEST thing to put on a resume, that relates to trading. Not exactly blatantly say, "I am a trader" because like I said to smikester earlier, what weight does that even hold? An interviewer would read that statement and be like, "....... ok?"

"That's why college institutions are still churning out fools by the bucket-loads. Young adults don't know anything about risk."
Not even going to argue with you haha

Edit: So do you think I should also have a track record ready to show if they ask?
  • #194
  • Feb 6, 2018 11:19am Feb 6, 2018 11:19am
Quoting Ganative
{quote} No, I haven't the slightest clue what the insurance industry really did to generate profits. It wasn't until my professor explained to me about the concept of 'premiums' when it hit me. Yes you are definitely right, society doesn't teach how to identify risk... this is something you can't learn in the classroom. When I understood the significance of 'risk' and 'probability', that's when I became a better poker player. Right, I used that as an analogy. I don't mean actually 'buying' opportunities. I just meant an attractive resume will spark...
It comes from a reliable 3rd party firm. Don't print out your history or something. https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=9h3lByx59ns

Just watch this presentation (1-hour). It'll explain enough of it for you and be well worth your time. It was one of my first real insights into the industry. I'd never pay Anton for 'trading lessons' but he does break things down well.
"The fun is in the hunt. Not the kill."
  • #195
  • Feb 6, 2018 10:54pm Feb 6, 2018 10:54pm
Quoting Redeflect
{quote} It comes from a reliable 3rd party firm. Don't print out your history or something. https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=9h3lByx59ns Just watch this presentation (1-hour). It'll explain enough of it for you and be well worth your time. It was one of my first real insights into the industry. I'd never pay Anton for 'trading lessons' but he does break things down well.
Cool, I recognize Anton Kreil from Million Dollar Traders.

Well, like what he said. He happened to be lucky as a student when Goldman was doing one of their "milk runs" and came across Anton. Anton said that he provided a track record, which showed his performance across different situations he was trading in, then that led Goldman to invite him for interviews.

Anton stated that everybody has a bachelors or masters degree but with no type of other experience, you have to differentiate yourself from the rest. Which makes sense lol... if you want to get a trading job then you gotta show them that you experienced trading with real money and actually applied real trading methodology, then you stand out in a huge way. So this was originally what we were already talking about lol. Nothing surprising!
  • #196
  • Feb 7, 2018 3:42am Feb 7, 2018 3:42am
Dear Ganative,

Just like Anton Kreil as you mentioned, all of those who became remarkably successful on any field you can imagine have similar characteristics that separates them from the crowd. Thing that cannot be tought in school or university but you start learning and developing during your childhood. Companies start to value and focus on non cognitive skills more every year. In life, all those objectively non measurable skills like persistence, determination, communication skills, adaptation etc actually makes who you are and what you will be. You cannot plan to be CEO of a company, there is no career path but someone ends up there. 10 years from now on no one even yourself won't care any less what school or university you finished or if you finish it with honors etc. All matters is what do you want and how bad do you want it. Are you committed hard working and love what you are doing. If you do your part of the deal you will shine and before you look for a job you will be picked up (like Anton) . Have passion and focus on beatin your own records. I can give countless examples who doesn't hold a university degree yet they own or managing Fortune 500 companies. So don't stuck with what to write to your CV or how to be more appealing in a job interview but focus on where you want to be and act on it. That might be the holy grail
  • #197
  • Edited 8:21pm Feb 7, 2018 4:36pm | Edited 8:21pm
Quoting Kxeroo
Dear Ganative, Just like Anton Kreil as you mentioned, all of those who became remarkably successful on any field you can imagine have similar characteristics that separates them from the crowd. Thing that cannot be tought in school or university but you start learning and developing during your childhood. Companies start to value and focus on non cognitive skills more every year. In life, all those objectively non measurable skills like persistence, determination, communication skills, adaptation etc actually makes who you are and what you will...
"If you do your part of the deal you will shine"... That's exciting to think about.
I had to read that two times, that's really motivating advice. Thank you

To be honest though, I want to work at a corporate level job just to experience it, meet different people, and build up massive capital (for making even larger profits with trading of course...)
Trading itself gets lonely. There is no one you can talk to about this in real life besides maybe a select few people who have an appreciation for this.
I couldn't imagine dropping everything just to trade at home and being alone all the time because I made a decision to not get a job and put myself out there in the "outside" world.
I refuse to amount my life to just watching numbers go up and down everyday, and relying on people on a forum whom I've never met for emotional stability.
There is more to life than this...

I read posts from other people (like you for instance) and they talk about their wives and their kids, and all that great stuff.
I wanna experience what it's like to live life before I can just retire and solely trade.

Trading will always be there for me and hopefully I can retire early because of this very skill.
After several years at some corporate job, I'd want to trade on my iPhone like I do now, and live a life of leisure with (hopefully) my wife and kid(s).
I think that's my ultimate goal.
  • #198
  • Feb 10, 2018 9:41pm Feb 10, 2018 9:41pm
Quoting Kxeroo
Prior to my son's delivery they put my wife into NST (Non Stress Test) , measuring the heart beat of the baby for 20 mins and recording on a paper. I was reading that like a chart and telling my wife everything seem to be good. Our doctor was suprised. So I guess if you can read a chart in FX you can read any kind of chart . Chart reading should be on a resume.
looks like we all have a safety net to fall back on :ECG analyst:
...
  • #199
  • Feb 10, 2018 11:58pm Feb 10, 2018 11:58pm
Quoting Piquant
{quote} looks like we all have a safety net to fall back on :ECG analyst:
Indeed we do. And those newbies funding their first live account with their life time saving or bank loan and experiencing huge drawdowns regularly, can check out job openings for preists. There is huge amounth of career options we can switch if trading doesnt work out for us.
  • #200
  • Feb 11, 2018 2:53am Feb 11, 2018 2:53am
Quoting Kxeroo
{quote} Indeed we do. And those newbies funding their first live account with their life time saving or bank loan and experiencing huge drawdowns regularly, can check out job openings for preists. There is huge amounth of career options we can switch if trading doesnt work out for us.
While I like your sense of humor you're speaking on a subject that many of us avoid at all costs, :what if it doesn't work out:, "what do I do if everything else fails: but every time I hit walls and bricks it all comes back up again infecting my mind. Moral of the story don't put all your eggs into a single basket and always have a plan B especially if you've got everything to lose, wife/husband family and kids but if you're single and relatively young I say why not give it your all while you can afford to , but all not in a sense of gamble away all of your savings you can still trade with 1K to 5K and build it up if you don't need to cover your living expenses in the next year or so but your time, effort.
...
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