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  • #42,121
  • Edited 6:27am Sep 15, 2024 4:31am | Edited 6:27am
Quoting Bizziebee
{quote} Thanks for your detailed analysis. Just to mention that these guys don't refund your challenge fee on successful passing. Hantec don't accept traders from UK and USA also I think. Blueberry Funded is definitely the best option for 1 step challenge seeing that it's static drawdown. One can get a 20% discount at the moment so a 25k challenge is $120 which is not bad. Maybe worth a try? Only downside is the miserable leverage plus the weird leverage/margin rule which will make reaching the target and arduous process
That's why everything has its ideal size, but it's not an unchangeable criterion. A $25k account is too small for decent profits (if successful), plus you might have to work for a month with all the pathethic blueberry rules. I would be happy with a $150 fee per bet for 50k if they lowered the profit target to 6%, with a 30-day timeframe and just 67% profit sharing. A $200 fee per bet for 50k would also be acceptable if they removed all the trading rules.

Actually, for a 50k account, there's additional info: they offer a discounted price of $160, but with trailing EOD. Rapid Challenge (Target Profit 5%, Total Loss 4%, 30 Days, Profit Split 80%, Refundable).

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  • #42,122
  • Sep 15, 2024 4:44am Sep 15, 2024 4:44am
Quoting RoelsMajor
{quote} That's why everything has its ideal size, but it's not an unchangeable criterion. A $25k account is too small for decent profits (if successful), plus you might have to work for a month with all the pathethic blueberry rules. I would be happy with a $150 fee per bet if they lowered the profit target to 6%, with a 30-day timeframe and just 67% profit sharing. A $200 fee per bet would also be acceptable if they removed all the trading rules. Actually, for a 50k account, there's additional info: they offer a discounted price of $160, but with...
Easy math: How to compare that offer with your personal broker account having $2k deposit as this is the max. loss from this 50k prop challenge ?

$160*2.72^(1.25)*1.5=ca. $840. EOD DD makes it 50% harder than static DD and Euler figure is used for compounding, which is 2500 goal versus / 2000 Max loss = 1.25. And $160 is fee you pay. You see without discount the value is about double what you have on personal account. That is all the advantage, not more. And they have some additional rules. Also you need to do a challenge before funded. So if you get funded you need to do some profits again. So you basically take $840 opportunity cost with multiplying 2.72 which is Euler figure for doing 2k profit on a 2k max. loss on funded. So basically you "pay" around $2280 to get $1500 or $2k as prop payout ? right ? This is negative business for you as trader doing that challenge then. Everyone should do this math on his own and then again decide, if it is okay.
  • #42,123
  • Sep 15, 2024 4:57am Sep 15, 2024 4:57am
Quoting Stoneyrocks
{quote} Why not do open a Darwinex account then we are sure Tranny is not faking , photoshopping results…
If I had your contact and adress data, I would contact the police and then you got a letter from my lawyer. You already own my a 5 digit amount from those personal attacks against me. I even would put you in jail as long as possible if you did not pay a huge amount as compensation for the harm you provided against me and others.
  • #42,124
  • Edited 6:00am Sep 15, 2024 4:58am | Edited 6:00am
Quoting TrAndy1
{quote} Easy math: How to compare that offer with your personal broker account having $2k deposit as this is the max. loss from this 50k prop challenge ? $160*2.72^(1.25)*1.5=ca. $840. EOD DD makes it 50% harder than static DD and Euler figure is used for compounding, which is 2500 goal versus / 2000 Max loss = 1.25. And $160 is fee you pay. You see without discount the value is about double what you have on personal account. That is all the advantage, not more. And they have some additional rules. Also you need to do a challenge before funded....
Let's discuss this by meditating in a mathematical way. Returning to the current offer:

Blueberry Funded 50k
Spent $0.22k – Static DD
Target Profit 10% -----> 5k. Total 55k.
Then add 2nd Target Profit (say target fee $0.22k) -----> 0.44%

Personal Broker Account 2k
Spent $2k – No DD Rules
Target Profit 5k. Total 7k. -----> 250%

Risk:
$0.22k Vs $2k
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  • #42,125
  • Sep 15, 2024 5:05am Sep 15, 2024 5:05am
Quoting RoelsMajor
{quote} Let's discuss this by meditating in a mathematical way. Returning to the current offer: Blueberry Funded 50k Spent $0.22k – Static DD Target Profit 10% -----> 5k. Total 55k. Personal Broker Account 2k Spent $2k – No DD Rules Target Profit 5k. Total 7k. -----> 250% Risk: $0.22k Vs $2k
What are you comparing now ? The 2 step offer or what ? You had a different offer before posted. Give me that link to that.

You have 10% Phase 1 and 5% Phase 2 or what you are comparing now ? It is not clear what you write.

Is that 1 step you are comparing now ? Before you had written about the Rapid model. YOu need to compare targets to max. Drawdown and then use Euler figure.
  • #42,126
  • Sep 15, 2024 5:11am Sep 15, 2024 5:11am
Quoting TrAndy1
{quote} What are you comparing now ? The 2 step offer or what ? You had a different offer before posted. Give me that link to that. You have 10% Phase 1 and 5% Phase 2 or what you are comparing now ? It is not clear what you write.
See this post https://www.forexfactory.com/thread/...7#post14998227 for reference. The post you quoted is a continuation of the discussion and assumptions. If you want to compare it to the $160 EOD model (latest new offer), it's the same situation. A personal $2k account still cannot outperform a funded account unless you have the same amount of deposit. And we dont talk about compounding in this case. So no need Euler number (figure) here or Euler Constant.
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  • #42,127
  • Sep 15, 2024 5:14am Sep 15, 2024 5:14am
Okay, I will compare the 1 phase model of Bluberry Funded $50k challenge.

1 step, 10% target to 6% max. Drawdown. You pay as fee $275 for that. So compare that with a 6% of 50k so a $3k personal account.
$275 [fee] * 2.72 [Euler figure for proper compounding]^(10% [Profit Target] / 6% [Max. Drawdown for that account before restart required] = $275*2.72^(1.666) =
ca. $1460 as opportunity cost for that challenge doing all the required tasks and goals before you get funded.

Then say you wanna do 6% target on Funded account versus 6% max. DD as risk. So you basically multiply then $1460 with 2.72, which is ca. $3970.
Your profit split is 80% on that $3k profit you made. So you get $2400 as compensation for all the work versus you had compounded that $275 fee on personal to $4k !
  • #42,128
  • Sep 15, 2024 5:16am Sep 15, 2024 5:16am
Quoting RoelsMajor
{quote} See this post https://www.forexfactory.com/thread/...7#post14998227 for reference. The post you quoted is a continuation of the discussion and assumptions. If you want to compare it to the $160 EOD model (latest new offer), it's the same situation. A personal $2k account still cannot outperform a funded account unless you have the same amount of deposit.
What is your calculation please ? Please post the formula you have in mind or in your head, as it is not clear what you are comparing. Then I can look over.
  • #42,129
  • Sep 15, 2024 5:22am Sep 15, 2024 5:22am
Quoting TrAndy1
{quote} What is your calculation please ? Please post the formula you have in mind or in your head, as it is not clear what you are comparing. Then I can look over.
As I said no need formula for simple math. I compare risk and benefit between $160 (50k) funded account with 2k personal account like you said. So why make it complicated? Same like $220 account (50K). Yes, there is a slight difference regarding the profit percentage target, but the calculation is the same. And it has nothing to do with EOD.
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  • #42,130
  • Sep 15, 2024 5:25am Sep 15, 2024 5:25am
Quoting RoelsMajor
{quote} As I said no need formula for simple math. I compare risk and benefit between $160 (50k) funded account with 2k personal account like you said. So why So why make it complicated?
Because there are parameters like goals and max. risk. Then you have trailing EOD too in some cases which makes it harder. Also before you get funded you need to pass challenge. How difficult is doing that challenge based on the fee you paid for ? You can do that math like I have done it. But you need to calculate somewhat surely.
  • #42,131
  • Edited 5:59am Sep 15, 2024 5:39am | Edited 5:59am
Quoting TrAndy1
{quote} Because there are parameters like goals and max. risk. Then you have trailing EOD too in some cases which makes it harder. Also before you get funded you need to pass challenge. How difficult is doing that challenge based on the fee you paid for ? You can do that math like I have done it. But you need to calculate somewhat surely.
Oh, you're mixing it with psychology, and there are many subjective criteria that can't be measured. I'm not an economist who can calculate psychology value with formula, and there's no definitive value for that.

Blueberry Funded 50k
Spent $0.16k – Static DD
Target Profit 5% -----> 2.5k. Total 52.5k.
Then add 2nd Target Profit (say target fee $0.16k) -----> 0.32%

Personal Broker Account 2k
Spent $2k – No DD Rules
Target Profit 2.5k. Total 4.5k. -----> 125%

Risk:
$0.16k Vs $2k
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Meditation All Time Return: 8.9%
  • #42,132
  • Sep 15, 2024 5:58am Sep 15, 2024 5:58am
Quoting TrAndy1
{quote} You should do this on your own. I do not want to convince you if you do not have the insight yourself. You should convince yourself. And by the way you never get 50k as capital. You get $2500 as drawdown. So open $2.5k personal versus comparing all outgoing money and income from prop side, okay ? You will be surprised, I bet.
You are knowledgeable and seem to be an expert in this field, hence would love to invite you to take the challenge with me. Or are you laughing at the $50K proposed then we go for the $150k.
Or you cannot afford $50k account with your personal broker like me. Then you open a $2500 account and I go with the $50k with MFFU.
We shorten the time to 1 month for the challenge to save you from multiple margin calls.
  • #42,133
  • Sep 15, 2024 8:31am Sep 15, 2024 8:31am
Hello guys, I have been seeing more and more video's about Apex requesting video's of your trades. Not just that, they want to see you trade. How can some one manage that? did any one here get a request from apex for a video recording?

I normally trade from my work and it would be a problem to do that.
Drawdown is more important than Account Size !
  • #42,134
  • Sep 15, 2024 8:43am Sep 15, 2024 8:43am
Quoting Bizziebee
Only downside is the miserable leverage plus the weird leverage/margin rule which will make reaching the target and arduous process
I had this conversation with taskid some days ago and now you come with the same thing. I fear that I'm missing something. What miserable leverage are you referring to ? (I mean forex leverage)
  • #42,135
  • Sep 15, 2024 10:40am Sep 15, 2024 10:40am
Quoting RoelsMajor
{quote} Oh, you're mixing it with psychology, and there are many subjective criteria that can't be measured. I'm not an economist who can calculate psychology value with formula, and there's no definitive value for that. Blueberry Funded 50k Spent $0.16k – Static DD Target Profit 5% -----> 2.5k. Total 52.5k. Then add 2nd Target Profit (say target fee $0.16k) -----> 0.32% Personal Broker Account 2k Spent $2k – No DD Rules Target Profit 2.5k. Total 4.5k. -----> 125% Risk: $0.16k Vs $2k
I'll show 2 futures props........

1. A. Apex cost $33.33, so put 33.33 in personal account, apex requires 120% to pass, 120% gain in personal brings you to 73.32
B. Apex charges $85 activation fee, so add $85 to personal account to keep outlay the same, personal now $158.32
C. Apex buffer requires 104% gain, 104% in personal, brings you to $322.97
Now, you can actual withdrawal $2,000 from Apex or $322.97 from personal, ONLY 619% ROI or you can not withdrawal from either and you have $2,500
account with APEX, keeping in mind DD is now static or $322.97 in DD (personal, so entire account)....750% ROI Apex vs. personal

2. A. MFFU cost $48, put $48 in personal, same deal 120% to pass, personal becomes $105.6
B. MFFU has no activation fee, so no need to add to personal
C. MFFU buffer requires same 104% gain, same in personal brings you to $215.42
I don't believe you can withdrawal within buffer at MFFU, so you now have a $2,500 account (static DD) with MFFU or $215.42 in personal, this one is ONLY
1161% ROI

None of this bears in mind the size you will be able to trade, as you will have $33 or $48 in a personal account, so this will need to be more from the get go just to trade DOW micros, where with the props you can trade 6 -7 minis as the margin is on 50K.
So you can essentially take less than the cost of being able to trade even one YM micro and turn it into a $2,500 account.

I can math too, I was a statistics major, I'm simply not going to put forth the effort to build a spreadsheet for something that can be done in my head.
Once again, said it many times, props are meant to fuel and accelerate your personal account, in the above examples they will do so at 7.5 times and 11.6 times the rate vs. not using them. Now, when we consider copying accross 10, 20, 30............no brainer here. The risk is miniscule compared to the reward.
  • #42,136
  • Sep 15, 2024 11:04am Sep 15, 2024 11:04am
Quoting TortoiseFX
{quote} Hi Coastie or anyone else, Apologies for this question which is off topic, but not sure where else to ask it, and have failed to find it elsewhere. When it comes to back testing and looking at historic charts I cannot find a way to set the Quantower charts to a specific date in time, and also hold the chart there in place on the screen while I switch between different timeframes. I know there is a mini-scroll bar at the very bottom of the platform, to rapidly zoom back in time, and I also know how to download historic prices, but I unable...
I haven't figured out that feature yet as I use MT5 from my offshore broker for charting and Quanttower for trading.
  • #42,137
  • Sep 15, 2024 11:30am Sep 15, 2024 11:30am
Quoting coastie0194
{quote} I haven't figured out that feature yet as I use MT5 from my offshore broker for charting and Quanttower for trading.
I also come from an MT4 platform where this is such an easy thing to do :-)

But I was hoping to replicate this in Quantower where I can also analyse historic volume etc.

Thank you for feedback
  • #42,138
  • Sep 15, 2024 11:46am Sep 15, 2024 11:46am
Quoting Capablanca
{quote} I had this conversation with taskid some days ago and now you come with the same thing. I fear that I'm missing something. What miserable leverage are you referring to ? (I mean forex leverage)
Well compared to even Hantec they are offering only half (or less) the leverage of their competitors on Gold and Indices. You can only trade about 1 lot on Gold, so it means that you need to achieve a net 500 pips gain on a 50k account to reach the 10% target. How many of us have a net 500 pips gain on our accounts over the last month or even 3 months
  • #42,139
  • Sep 15, 2024 11:59am Sep 15, 2024 11:59am
Quoting Bizziebee
{quote} Well compared to even Hantec they are offering only half (or less) the leverage of their competitors on Gold and Indices. You can only trade about 1 lot on Gold, so it means that you need to achieve a net 500 pips gain on a 50k account to reach the 10% target. How many of us have a net 500 pips gain on our accounts over the last month or even 3 months
I only trade forex in props, not gold or indexes, and can't remember of having seen anything unusual in leverge.
I hope I haven't messed up reading the rules. You're already the second person, after takisd, bringing the leverage thing in blueberry. I need to revisit that today.
  • #42,140
  • Sep 15, 2024 12:34pm Sep 15, 2024 12:34pm
Just checked Blueberry leverage and max lots for forex
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If I didn't mess up:

1. Account size: 200K
2. Maximum margin requirement: 200K/1.5 = 133K
3. Leverage for forex 2 steps challenges: 1:50
4. Price of EURUSD: 1.10 (hypotetic)

5. Max lot size = (133K x 50) / 1.10 = 6M

6M means a max of 60 lots (aprox).

So, unless I made any mistake, Blueberry is OK for forex, unless people want to go for crazy lots. That's why I didn't have anything in my notes (I only take note of things that can affect me).
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