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  • #26,161
  • Nov 14, 2023 1:32am Nov 14, 2023 1:32am
Quoting Capablanca
{quote} Unfortunately I'm still very far away from having that problem. I don't even know what information will they ask for withdraw. Is there any screen that I can look at even if I don't have any payout yet ?
Ok, then I will yolo them and let you know if I get there... the cost was peanuts anyway.
PVSRA
  • #26,162
  • Nov 14, 2023 1:32am Nov 14, 2023 1:32am
Quoting Soros
{quote} seems like a risky aproach, are you trading different strategies in all of them? the ones u got funding from have you withdrawn?
my trading style remains same and even risk management as well. I just open one trade in one account manually no copy
Trading.

After trial n error this is my risk management. risk 1% per trade till i reach 3% and then directly risk 3% after that. My target is 20 pips with 1:1 and my win ratio is 80%. Sometimes i collect 10x2 pips trade but mostly 5x4pips trades.
For withdrawal waiting for my date on bespoke 1k profit on it i.e 100k account. After trandy case i dont take this account seriously. Other than that got funded on myflashfunding blown it in 3 days. Currently waiting for skilled funded trader funder account probably gonna get it by tomorrow as per customer support.
risk management for funding account after trial n error is .25% per trade and stop trading after 2%.

NOTE: started prop firm journey last month
Extreme gut feeling trader
  • #26,163
  • Edited 2:15am Nov 14, 2023 1:47am | Edited 2:15am
Quoting Soros
I see a trend with people looking to pass prop firms in 1week or 1month, honestly the dangerous traders are the ones that take 3months to pass or longer and spend the whole year scalling up they accounts and cashing out consistently, but i guess we all see things from different perspectives.
Prop trading is basically an extension of race trading. I haven't checked recently but the newer brokers used to have competitions to win $500 or so that you could use to fund your real account if you won. Maybe they still have those. The competitions were usually 30 days and up to recently, this was the prop time limit too. . The % gain in some of those competitions were insane. 3000% sometimes or some crazy hard to belive gains for the top traders. Some used EAs and odd few looked like they were manual.

So now it's more or less the same thing. You race trade with large sizes just like those competition accounts except you pay a mere entry fee to qualify to be in the race. If anyone is passing in a few days, guaranteed that they have the competition race trading mentality.

Now because of the props, that style of trading has become the standard for being considered a 'good' and successful trader. No big deal if as a trader you lose one of these competitions cause there is always another one and now there is always a $500 laying around or whatever the contest fee needs to be. The props have successfully managed to change the trading culture and make race trading a normal and expected way of trading.
  • #26,164
  • Nov 14, 2023 3:35am Nov 14, 2023 3:35am
Quoting OutThere
The props have successfully managed to change the trading culture and make race trading a normal and expected way of trading.
-It seems like the inevitable outcome. When you are trading your own money, it is much more difficult to trade that way unless you are trading a really small account or have money to burn (i.e. you just do not care, either way).

With prop, you can trade someone else's money for a small fee and there are no penalties for blowing the account, allowing you to keep doing it over and over again. Clearly a no-brainer if you are even mildly good at trading.

The nature of the model not only allows for this, but thrives on this sort of high-risk, degenerate activity. It is a gambler's dream because the ante is peanuts compared to the pot size and your odds are more favorable than blackjack.
  • #26,165
  • Nov 14, 2023 3:56am Nov 14, 2023 3:56am
Quoting Nsak3y
{quote}-It seems like the inevitable outcome. When you are trading your own money, it is much more difficult to trade that way unless you are trading a really small account or have money to burn (i.e. you just do not care, either way). With prop, you can trade someone else's money for a small fee and there are no penalties for blowing the account, allowing you to keep doing it over and over again. Clearly a no-brainer if you are even mildly good at trading. The nature of the model not only allows for this, but thrives on this sort of high-risk,...
Very true.
And before the unlimited thing, this aggressive style was even forced by the props itself because one had to achieve 10%, at least phase 1, in just 30 days, aprox 22 trading days.
  • #26,166
  • Nov 14, 2023 4:33am Nov 14, 2023 4:33am
Quoting Expo33
{quote} Apparently, support is non-existent on the weekend. Chatbot useless. Discord useless. See if I get any response when I wake up. Plan for 2024 get back to the stalwarts in the industry. The ones I've trusted for 5 years. FTMO, 5ERS, CTI. Paying a little extra and/or maybe not having the perfect drawdown is meaningless to me at this point. Payout history and confidence in the company going forward is what matters most to me.
Which account with CTI ? Serious payouts ?
  • #26,167
  • Nov 14, 2023 6:32am Nov 14, 2023 6:32am
Quoting Expo33
{quote} Ironically, I watched a few bracketing videos including his already. My chart says "ATM" not "BRACKET". I was assuming it was the same thing but wasn't sure as mine looks a bit different. His chart is a bit busy. Makes me want to gouge my eyes out. But at least he speaks clearly and had the best video out of all the ones I watched.
Something that has never changed is most futures platforms are lacking intuitive interfaces. Yes Bracket orders you would use the ATM management. Example like below i had set for NQ.

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Trade with confidence, trade without fear.
  • #26,168
  • Nov 14, 2023 7:45am Nov 14, 2023 7:45am
31pips slippage on 8cap firm during CPI

thats huge
MY OPINION NOT FINANCIAL ADVISE
  • #26,169
  • Nov 14, 2023 7:49am Nov 14, 2023 7:49am
Quoting donfriday
31pips slippage on 8cap firm during CPI thats huge
Yeah not an 8cap fan!
  • #26,170
  • Nov 14, 2023 8:00am Nov 14, 2023 8:00am
CFD migrants flooding into APEX futures getting hurt. Best entertainment since MFF discord.

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Trade with confidence, trade without fear.
  • #26,171
  • Edited 9:38am Nov 14, 2023 8:26am | Edited 9:38am
Quoting OutThere
{quote} Prop trading is basically an extension of race trading. I haven't checked recently but the newer brokers used to have competitions to win $500 or so that you could use to fund your real account if you won. Maybe they still have those. The competitions were usually 30 days and up to recently, this was the prop time limit too. . The % gain in some of those competitions were insane. 3000% sometimes or some crazy hard to belive gains for the top traders. Some used EAs and odd few looked like they were manual. So now it's more or less the same...
Ive been thinking about this lately why they have all these discounts. Since obviously it must be very profitable for the prop firms. This mentality in itself I would say is very dangerous for the serious trader. If you think you wont get affected by if u keep changing trading styles from this racing to the top wild west method and serious trading with personal account then Im sure most are in for a surprise. Since as most kinda veterans say trading is 90% psychology. Ive noticed its correct. So if you try to play games with your own mind, and dont respect how fragile the mind is.

The way one trade overall will become affected even if one trade decent now on personal account im sure that will become affected as well due to wild west style trading with prop firms lately with discounts which seems to be the trend. Its almost as if these prop firms knows it. No idea how they calculate these things but seems to be very accurate profit wise and how mind psychology works.
  • #26,172
  • Nov 14, 2023 8:32am Nov 14, 2023 8:32am
Quoting OutThere
{quote} Prop trading is basically an extension of race trading. I haven't checked recently but the newer brokers used to have competitions to win $500 or so that you could use to fund your real account if you won. Maybe they still have those. The competitions were usually 30 days and up to recently, this was the prop time limit too. . The % gain in some of those competitions were insane. 3000% sometimes or some crazy hard to belive gains for the top traders. Some used EAs and odd few looked like they were manual. So now it's more or less the same...
because of this reason you mention so many people get less good in trading by using prop, because anything you do change your brain (if you want or dont want).
props push to trade the wrong way (for trade own money or be long term successful to earn big money on end), that is one of the reason why not one very good trader used a prop game style company (at least i never did see it, maybe someone did because did not think about deep enough). of course opportunity costs are a second big reason too.
  • #26,173
  • Nov 14, 2023 9:07am Nov 14, 2023 9:07am
Quoting Cryptosurf
CFD migrants flooding into APEX futures getting hurt. Best entertainment since MFF discord. {image}
Wow....."I didn't even know about the news........is this my fault?"
There is literally zero accountability left in this world.
Perhaps they should call EVERY trader on their service prior to the news to alert them?????
  • #26,174
  • Nov 14, 2023 9:10am Nov 14, 2023 9:10am
Quoting labu
{quote} Ive been thinking about this lately why they have all these discounts. Since obviously it must be very profitable for the prop firms. This mentality in itself I would say is very dangerous for the serious trader. If you think you wont get affected by if u keep changing trading styles from this racing to the top wild west method and serious trading with personal account then Im sure most are are in for a surprise. Since as most kinda veterans say trading is 90% psychology. Ive noticed its correct. So if you try to play games with your own...
The serious trader knows how to trade in their own accounts and in prop accounts.

It's basically like the poker player that is grinding in a professional way, day after day, and some day just goes for the fun to blow up X USD from his pocket as entertainment. In our case prop is not entertainment but is a different mindset: making quick bucks to fund our own accounts.

There's zero confusion on any serious trader's mind IMO.
  • #26,175
  • Nov 14, 2023 9:12am Nov 14, 2023 9:12am
Quoting pipmaster77
{quote} Wow....."I didn't even know about the news........is this my fault?" There is literally zero accountability left in this world. Perhaps they should call EVERY trader on their service prior to the news to alert them?????
I'm still laughing at those print screens. It's these days when we miss more MFF. That Discord was something better than any Monty Python sketch.
  • #26,176
  • Nov 14, 2023 9:19am Nov 14, 2023 9:19am
Quoting labu
{quote} Ive been thinking about this lately why they have all these discounts. Since obviously it must be very profitable for the prop firms. This mentality in itself I would say is very dangerous for the serious trader. If you think you wont get affected by if u keep changing trading styles from this racing to the top wild west method and serious trading with personal account then Im sure most are are in for a surprise. Since as most kinda veterans say trading is 90% psychology. Ive noticed its correct. So if you try to play games with your own...
Formula has not changed for me from day 1, simply less risky for those just starting now due to unlimited time.
1. Pay $500,, make 80-100% (8-10% target, 10% DD), then make 50%.......the $500 if traded on your own would be $1,500
2. Get your refund, you now have ZERO risk and a $10K max loss (100K account with 10% DD). Let's call it $8,500-9,000 due to 85-90% split.
EVEN IF THERE WAS NO REFUND, YOU HAVE 6x MORE MONEY TO TRADE OVER THE PERSONAL ACCOUNT
Another huge point, when you withdrawal from the prop, you still have 10K max loss, withdrawal from personal, it takes away from your equity.
3. If full-time trader, all profits beyond your living expenses go into personal account(s). If part-time, ALL profits go into personal account(s).
4. Trade personal account based on "normal" risk, as account grows, either profit increases or risk decreases(both are great things)

IMO, this is the ONLY way to take advantadge of the prop opportunity.
  • #26,177
  • Nov 14, 2023 9:24am Nov 14, 2023 9:24am
Quoting Capablanca
{quote} The serious trader knows how to trade in their own accounts and in prop accounts. It's basically like the poker player that is grinding in a professional way, day after day, and some day just goes for the fun to blow up X USD from his pocket as entertainment. In our case prop is not entertainment but is a different mindset: making quick bucks to fund our own accounts. There's zero confusion on any serious trader's mind IMO.
100% spot on....the props are just here to accelerate your personal account at 6 times the pace. It's a no-brainer.
If one can't wrap their head around this and control their mind set, this is the WRONG business to be in.
  • #26,178
  • Nov 14, 2023 9:40am Nov 14, 2023 9:40am
New FTMO Premium Programme
https://ftmo.com/en/premium-programme/
Money is made by sitting, not trading
  • #26,179
  • Nov 14, 2023 9:44am Nov 14, 2023 9:44am
Quoting pipmaster77
{quote} 100% spot on....the props are just here to accelerate your personal account at 6 times the pace. It's a no-brainer. If one can't wrap their head around this and control their mind set, this is the WRONG business to be in.
but this only works for traders who are not very successful already and so have small private accounts against traders who are successful and have very big private accounts. in general a trader with a small private account of less of some 100k from his wins (not simple by deposit the money) will not be considered a good or successful trader, but maybe he will get one over next decades or years. so the 6 times the pace works only for the traders at maximum medium level success, so will not be a case for any professional trader. of course when someone won 1 million in one trade in crypto will not count as super trader, so only to look at the amount won is not enough, needs to be over long time with many trades. but without won a big amount nobody ever would call someone a very good successful trader, because big wins come automatic by doing the process right step by step.

their exist some traders who are very good traders and lost all money they won because wrong decisions in life outside of trading, but this kind of people are not a lot to lose all totally.
  • #26,180
  • Nov 14, 2023 9:47am Nov 14, 2023 9:47am
Quoting pipmaster77
{quote} 100% spot on....the props are just here to accelerate your personal account at 6 times the pace. It's a no-brainer. If one can't wrap their head around this and control their mind set, this is the WRONG business to be in.
I can imagine this is true or possible if having 15years+ trading experience with personal accounts as professional. Then the traditional style trading with personal is so ingrained in your head you would maybe become unaffected by the new prop firm style for a short time usage.

What Im mostly referring too is this heavy gambling mindset lately and trend with use of discounts. I do think prop firms can be ok if treating them as real personal accounts even in the personal account trading style. Maybe gains wont be as high. But should still be profitable enough to add to personal account without jeopardizing the trading style overall ones used too.
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Metcalfe