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  • #17,021
  • Jun 23, 2023 4:54pm Jun 23, 2023 4:54pm
Quoting Zebi
how can you trust them with your credit or debit card info much less your bank account numbers? seems it would be very easy for the shady ones to start stealing and co-opting someones identity
-Credit cards usually have charge-backs for fraud. Some banks, credit cards and other services may offer identity-theft and fraud protection etc.. Businesses are conducted under LLC. Accounts are FDIC-insured. All transfers and purchases are carefully tracked and monitored.

I receive a notice within 30-seconds of any purchase over $300. Similarly, if any purchase is made to a non-US entity, the purchase is automatically blocked until I personally verify it. In most cases, companies receive TIN, not a personal social. Anything beyond that, I am not too worried about.
  • #17,022
  • Jun 23, 2023 5:05pm Jun 23, 2023 5:05pm
Quoting Takisd
But it’s definitely a risk, especially the kyc part
This is a point I think a lot about.

We see more recently props using third entities to make the KYC process (specially documents and selfies). I'm not sure, though, if the prop firms receive any copy of those or just a confirmation that trader A is really trader A.

In the past it was terrible. Uploading documents in pdf or sending them by email was always I was afraid of. I hope we are a little better now but I don't know.
  • #17,023
  • Jun 23, 2023 5:08pm Jun 23, 2023 5:08pm
Quoting Capablanca
{quote} This is a point I think a lot about. We see more recently props using third entities to make the KYC process (specially documents and selfies). I'm not sure, though, if the prop firms receive any copy of those or just a confirmation that trader A is really trader A. In the past it was terrible. Uploading documents in pdf or sending them by email was always I was afraid of. I hope we are a little better now but I don't know.
they have to be able to access it or they are non compliant
  • #17,024
  • Jun 24, 2023 1:54am Jun 24, 2023 1:54am
Quoting Takisd
Is b booking a Ponzi if there are mostly losers? Ponzi is paying out old investors with new money. Suggesting all will make money, brokers and props are not promising anyone will make anything. So is it a Ponzi?
Props are promising you huge amounts of (fake) investment funds if you are able to clear almost impossible challenges. B-bookers don't promise anything and for the trader it shouldn't make much of a a difference if you are losing against the criminal banks or forex brokers as both will make sure that in most cases you will eventually lose.

The whole world is a big Ponzi starting from religion.
  • #17,025
  • Jun 24, 2023 2:45am Jun 24, 2023 2:45am
Quoting Takisd
using Darwinex as an example is a bit funny, their policies and stringent as fuck. You won’t get anywhere near the offering from them that you get from any of these props timeframe or not.
This is off topic but what do you mean by stringent? I've been playing with their caluclator and if you have a cumulative return in the prior 5 months of 10% with a max drawdown in the last 6 months of -20% then all you need is 1.42% return this month to achieve their 75.00 threshold to get a 25k guaranteed funding. This is much better than any prop offering.
  • #17,026
  • Jun 24, 2023 3:16am Jun 24, 2023 3:16am
Quoting noox
{quote} This is off topic but what do you mean by stringent? I've been playing with their caluclator and if you have a cumulative return in the prior 5 months of 10% with a max drawdown in the last 6 months of -20% then all you need is 1.42% return this month to achieve their 75.00 threshold to get a 25k guaranteed funding. This is much better than any prop offering.
Do you have a link to the calculator? Darwin's payout of obviously inferior compared to props but the 15% is still somewhat acceptable considering the long term opportunity.
  • #17,027
  • Jun 24, 2023 4:16am Jun 24, 2023 4:16am
Quoting noox
{quote} This is off topic but what do you mean by stringent? I've been playing with their caluclator and if you have a cumulative return in the prior 5 months of 10% with a max drawdown in the last 6 months of -20% then all you need is 1.42% return this month to achieve their 75.00 threshold to get a 25k guaranteed funding. This is much better than any prop offering.
Well for starters you need the return for prior 5 months.

so if you are good, for 5 months which eliminates even most live accounts on the new prop system, you can get funded 25k. Now calculate that 25k let’s say you make 10 percent in next 5 months which is 2500, what’s your split? Then calculate with them what you would need to do to make a liveable income from their system.

the data is against you that’s why it’s harder and more stringent, only the good traders will make it there.

every ICT, SMC IML moving average trader and his dog can make money from the retail shops you just have to adjust to the model.

just from the above you can see why not many people are funded there and it’s not for a lack of tryin.

in that 5 months they have an activity requirement no? Or had that changed
  • #17,028
  • Jun 24, 2023 4:16am Jun 24, 2023 4:16am
Quoting TraderTero
{quote} Props are promising you huge amounts of (fake) investment funds if you are able to clear almost impossible challenges. B-bookers don't promise anything and for the trader it shouldn't make much of a a difference if you are losing against the criminal banks or forex brokers as both will make sure that in most cases you will eventually lose. The whole world is a big Ponzi starting from religion.
passing a prop firm, any of them, is not that difficult, difficult is getting paid.
  • #17,029
  • Jun 24, 2023 5:07am Jun 24, 2023 5:07am
Quoting Takisd
{quote} passing a prop firm, any of them, is not that difficult, difficult is getting paid.
On average 93-95% of people fail and some 0.1-0.2% get to the first payment. Sounds quite difficult to me.
  • #17,030
  • Jun 24, 2023 5:34am Jun 24, 2023 5:34am
Quoting TraderTero
{quote} On average 93-95% of people fail and some 0.1-0.2% get to the first payment. Sounds quite difficult to me.
I think the pass rate rn is 8-10 percent. But that includes huge numbers of people who buy eas from the mql5 store.
  • #17,031
  • Jun 24, 2023 6:50am Jun 24, 2023 6:50am
Quoting pipmaster77
{quote} Brokers, prop firms, all of it........a winning trader is a liability. They want you to lose. How ridiculous is it that we trade against these entities and they control the entire game........spread, slippage, freeze the platform, random price spikes, etc. Imagine betting sports with a bookmaker and knowing they could control the outcome of the game. Playing roulette where YOU KNEW they had a magnet under the table and could make the ball land wherever they wanted. Yes, extreme examples, but not that far off. This is the main reason I started...
I agree. I sent you a message. Thank you for your review & response.
  • #17,032
  • Jun 24, 2023 7:18am Jun 24, 2023 7:18am
Why are people acting like Unlimited accounts don't expire? Most have a 30-day inactivity limit. Losing traders may hang onto their accounts longer but eventually will give up and the 30 days will pass. I don't see it turning into a major issue as a cost factor. I'm sure the increased business activity justifies the marginally increased cost.
  • #17,033
  • Jun 24, 2023 7:45am Jun 24, 2023 7:45am
Quoting TraderTero
{quote} On average 93-95% of people fail and some 0.1-0.2% get to the first payment. Sounds quite difficult to me.
Passing challenge is not that difficult to me.

1.Take trades at levels only... and when you find a place to buy or sell, go with good lot size, with stop loss in place. when you made good money in a particular day.. use it as cushion for daily loss limit and take more scalping trades to maximise daily profit- Method 1

2.Take trades at important places only.. do this every day so as not to risk more than 2 % in a day.

The reward can be 0.6 to 2 % in a day. - Method 2

Trading funded account also will be challenge... use weekly trend with reduced risk.

I usually follow method 1 and finish phase 1 in 2 to 3 days.
Intraday only.
  • #17,034
  • Jun 24, 2023 8:22am Jun 24, 2023 8:22am
Quoting BlackOpz
Why are people acting like Unlimited accounts don't expire? Most have a 30-day inactivity limit. Losing traders may hang onto their accounts longer but eventually will give up and the 30 days will pass. I don't see it turning into a major issue as a cost factor. I'm sure the increased business activity justifies the marginally increased cost.
very valid argument. I think no time limit for it to make sense needs a plethora of rules. Max trades open at once including pending, max lot size variance to prevent the yolo last chance traders, inactivity but tighter than 30 days, say 10 days maybe some more. But the rules required for it to make sense would likely not be digested well by the community
  • #17,035
  • Jun 24, 2023 9:42am Jun 24, 2023 9:42am
Quoting pipmaster77
{quote} Brokers, prop firms, all of it........a winning trader is a liability. They want you to lose. How ridiculous is it that we trade against these entities and they control the entire game........spread, slippage, freeze the platform, random price spikes, etc. Imagine betting sports with a bookmaker and knowing they could control the outcome of the game. Playing roulette where YOU KNEW they had a magnet under the table and could make the ball land wherever they wanted. Yes, extreme examples, but not that far off. This is the main reason I started...

You don’t need props for trading. Just going with 1 % daily you can have 12 times your begin money in one year. It is only interesting when you need quick money.


1 % daily growth in a couple of years will create a lot of numbers
  • #17,036
  • Jun 24, 2023 12:02pm Jun 24, 2023 12:02pm
Quoting Eren10
{quote} You don’t need props for trading. Just going with 1 % daily you can have 12 times your begin money in one year. It is only interesting when you need quick money. 1 % daily growth in a couple of years will create a lot of numbers
I requote this sentence as :

Problem when you need quick money
Intraday only.
  • #17,037
  • Jun 24, 2023 1:34pm Jun 24, 2023 1:34pm
Quoting navk
{quote} I requote this sentence as : Problem when you need quick money
True . But you have higher chance to make 1000 to 30 k in a couple of months by using a 200 K prop account.
  • #17,038
  • Jun 24, 2023 2:41pm Jun 24, 2023 2:41pm
1 percent daily and in 5 years you own fiji
  • #17,039
  • Jun 24, 2023 3:43pm Jun 24, 2023 3:43pm
Quoting Eren10
{quote} You don’t need props for trading. Just going with 1 % daily you can have 12 times your begin money in one year. It is only interesting when you need quick money. 1 % daily growth in a couple of years will create a lot of numbers
$1000 can BUY 4X 50K challenges. GREAT Use Of Cash. Plus show me where you make 1% per day for 3 solid months (couple years LOL!?)
  • #17,040
  • Jun 24, 2023 3:52pm Jun 24, 2023 3:52pm
Quoting Takisd
{quote} very valid argument. I think no time limit for it to make sense needs a plethora of rules. Max trades open at once including pending, max lot size variance to prevent the yolo last chance traders, inactivity but tighter than 30 days, say 10 days maybe some more. But the rules required for it to make sense would likely not be digested well by the community
The 5ers has 10-day unlimited but as long as the accounts expire I just cant see the issue since people quit trading and abandon accounts all the time. Brokers offering unlimited time Demo accounts hasn't been an issue since they also expire after 30-days of inactivity. If FREE unlimited time accounts arent overloading broker servers I have a VERY hard time thinking that PAID unlimited accounts are going to be a problem (I've had Demo accounts with Oanda/Alpari for YEARS). When there will only be a fraction of the numbers compared to FREE Demo accounts. Non-Issue. (cant wait to update this with broker data is a few months)
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