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  • #16,341
  • Jun 4, 2023 10:48am Jun 4, 2023 10:48am
Quoting Capablanca
For Finotive Funding the things seems also shady, if not a scam. Basically there was a guy that lost 45K in previous funded account (don't know how many). He purchased more challenges (I think two). Then he passed one and they denied the funded account saying that he had lost 45K previously and had a gambling behavior. These is the correspondence: {image} {image} {image} {image} And this is the review in Trust Pilot: {image} {image} {image} Then the response from Finotive in the group: " Dear Leek, Thanks for taking the time to leave a review on...
Yes, this is outright scumbag behavior....if a trader loses on the funded account more than you are comfortable with (they probably b-booked and didn't lose a dime), BAN HIM RIGHT THEN......but, no, in true scumbag behavior, go ahead and keep taking and failing challenges and give us more money because as soon as you pass one, we will deny the account.
I keep a running list of firms that are maybe and absolutely not if I ever decide to add additional. Just deleted Finotive from the spreadhseet (I only added them after they removed that 25% split until we make our money back BS). Blue Guardian has never even made maybe on my spreadsheet.
Perhaps firms should have a policy of only purchasing x amount of challenges before you are no longer eligible OR
Perhaps if you are funded and lose, you are no longer eligible or maybe reapply in 6 months?
Yeah right...........keep paying and failing, we will **ck you over once you pass, don't worry!!!
  • #16,342
  • Jun 4, 2023 10:53am Jun 4, 2023 10:53am
Quoting OutThere
{quote} How do they even know someone's trades are the result of latency arbitrage? The way I understand it, you open platforms from 2 different brokers. The EA based on something similar to copy trading, somehow monitors the prices of both brokers and at opportune times locks in the difference in prices that happened obviously due to latency. Each instant of the trading platform will have its own set of trades that just look like buy and sells. You'd have to have both accounts side by side to see what is going on or you'd have to analyze the statements...
thats easy. any experienced trader see this in minutes looking in a account. there are even already plugins for detect latency arbitrage trades.

latency arbitrage is always " cheating " to your broker, when your broker it using slower data connection and so see real price delayed. its not real trading, because you know already the price, its like a very sure bet when you know result for sure already. of course any broker has in their Papers that this style of trading is forbidden, or any broker would get bankrupt when people would use it a lot - that is a total sure math fact.

you can detect very easy when many trades are opened or closed exactly in this time when price is different in broker and real market price because of connection delay. then for sure this person trades latency arbitrage. some try to hide with other trading styles, but only works when make small wins (so broker dont care)or broker is to stupid to detect, because detecting is total easy and fully possible to even automate. so near any broker will not pay you out this or at least you dont win big with this, its no real trading so of course no real big wins.

its a difference if you make agreements with different tier 1 over a prime of prime broker. and then trade the different feeds against each other. but the difference is very fast and small....long time ago many did...now you need to invest big money to get very fast connections to get the small wins there before other take the trades.
  • #16,343
  • Jun 4, 2023 10:59am Jun 4, 2023 10:59am
Quoting Takisd
I text from the beach! Happy summer.
-I hope that you did not type all of that up with your phone.

If you ever decide to start a youtube channel where you interview prop founders, please let me know about it. And have fun at the beach.
  • #16,344
  • Jun 4, 2023 11:04am Jun 4, 2023 11:04am
Quoting Takisd
This aint nothin but a summer Jam. I text from the beach! Happy summer. MFFX ceo is a kid. I dont think he means harm but he clearly doesnt know anything about forex, brokers, risk or risk management as an institution. The newbies are lapping it up but it wont last long as........ low and behold the slippage complaints appear. 8cap strikes again. Its a bit rich when a 26 yr old with a low cost solution changes a few rules then talks about revolutionizing the market place. He talks about being first at things, but i remember Funding talent and MFF...
Yes, I stated a couple of years ago, my MAIN REQUIREMENT of a firm was their own feed. I still stick to it. Not sure how I roped myself into TFTP, but I only have 200K with them and will not be adding anymore.
  • #16,345
  • Jun 4, 2023 11:09am Jun 4, 2023 11:09am
Quoting pipmaster77
but, no, in true scumbag behavior, go ahead and keep taking and failing challenges and give us more money because as soon as you pass one, we will deny the account.
Yep, it's a no losing proposition. You fail, we have the fee. You pass we deny and refund you. No risk.

Yep, they should have some kind of probatory period without purchasing or max amount loss.
  • #16,346
  • Jun 4, 2023 11:10am Jun 4, 2023 11:10am
Quoting Nsak3y
{quote}-I hope that you did not type all of that up with your phone. If you ever decide to start a youtube channel where you interview prop founders, please let me know about it. And have fun at the beach.
I have my ipad. No youtube for me, too ugly and at the moment, overweight.

finotive is crap, but i dont think they are crap for the above review.
  • #16,347
  • Jun 4, 2023 11:14am Jun 4, 2023 11:14am
Quoting pipmaster77
Perhaps firms should have a policy of only purchasing x amount of challenges before you are no longer eligible OR Perhaps if you are funded and lose, you are no longer eligible or maybe reapply in 6 months?
-A good way to kill the model, in either case. Which is why this case is a bit of a head-scratcher. If I try to really think objectively about this, then I have to consider the probability that they just did not handle this well and simply did not review his account at the right time, or at all, initially. I cannot think of how doing things this way would be beneficial for them.

This does not and should not absolve them from any wrong-doing, though. They obviously see him as a potential risk, just probably not in the way that they are making it out to be.

When I hear about stories of people trading with smaller firms like this, I cannot help but think that there is a very specific reasoning for it. Any trader that elects to go with a smaller firm that is not very well-established, comparatively speaking, has to take some responsibility for whatever outcome he or she may see from that.
  • #16,348
  • Jun 4, 2023 11:16am Jun 4, 2023 11:16am
Quoting Takisd
No youtube for me, too ugly and at the moment, overweight.
-Same. Maybe a podcast then.
  • #16,349
  • Jun 4, 2023 11:20am Jun 4, 2023 11:20am
Quoting Takisd
{quote} I have my ipad. No youtube for me, too ugly and at the moment, overweight. finotive is crap, but i dont think they are crap for the above review.
its fun to read your posts as always. I wonder what other firms you are trading with now besides MFF and FTMO.
  • #16,350
  • Jun 4, 2023 11:30am Jun 4, 2023 11:30am
Quoting Nsak3y
the probability that they just did not handle this well and simply did not review his account at the right time, or at all, initially.
If they have not revised it in a timely manner and still consider him a risk, I would say the minimum to do was to provide the funded account and maybe reduce leverage and/or daily DD. And a warning that this was the last account.

No point in allowing him to purchase, take the time to pass challenge (disrespect for the time wasted) and then refusing it, thinking that a refund absolve then from misconduct.
  • #16,351
  • Jun 4, 2023 11:33am Jun 4, 2023 11:33am
Quoting Boulder
{quote} its fun to read your posts as always. I wonder what other firms you are trading with now besides MFF and FTMO.
e8, rebel, t4t, tff, bespoke (EW yuck) and any other copy cat that appears i will likely purchase.

Prop firms have become a game for me, i dont trade seriously with them anymore as its no longer necessary for me to do so. FTMO and MFF i pay more attention to in terms of risk and such but basically I test anyone who yaps a lot in social media and any one that people talk a lot about in here.

I dodged Myfundedfx because its just eightcap again. It doesnt matter what rules you change as long as its 8cap its crap, they can pay me for the slogan later.

My last work contracts were involving props (risk analytics) and I can see what is going on other than with FTMO, some firms have their mind in the right direction and some do not. FTMO is always the mystery and literally no one has any real inside info other than payment services who suggest they aren't as big as is made out.

I can say confidently that there are 2 firms that are actually working on the issues that the model has and the others are just marketing to get customers in the door. FTMO is not one of the 2 firms. The other firms, in my not so humble opinion, do not have the mental capacity to even realise what the issue is.

For those watching at home, the issue is what to do with the order flow. Anyone just saying A book or B book doesn't understand the problem at all.
  • #16,352
  • Jun 4, 2023 11:44am Jun 4, 2023 11:44am
Quoting Takisd
FTMO is always the mystery and literally no one has any real inside info other than payment services who suggest they aren't as big as is made out.
Is this from inside information or public information ? Care to share your logic behind this comment ? I didn't get it.
Quoting Takisd
I can say confidently that there are 2 firms that are actually working on the issues that the model has and the others are just marketing to get customers in the door. FTMO is not one of the 2 firms. The other firms, in my not so humble opinion, do not have the mental capacity to even realise what the issue is. For those watching at home, the issue is what to do with the order flow. Anyone just saying A book or B book doesn't understand the problem at all.
Well, someone had to do the dirty work here.... Who are those 2 firms ?
-------------------
Btw, sometime ago someone said this, I don't recall where (probably in a telegram group):

"Whistle blower on The Funded Trader. They own
1. Top tier trader
2. Leveled up society
3. Fortunes funding
4. Secure the bag funding
5. Rocket 21 challenge
6. Smart prop trader
Using these small firms to create a large pool of funds connected together. Large scale pyramid/ponzi. The shadow company is Easton Consulting Technologies behind them all
Smart Prop Trader also has a hidden clause that will withhold your payments unless you do a trader interview if they so choose to"

Any truth here ?
  • #16,353
  • Jun 4, 2023 11:49am Jun 4, 2023 11:49am
Quoting Capablanca
{quote} Is this from inside information or public information ? Care to share your logic behind this comment ? I didn't get it. {quote} Well, someone had to do the dirty work here.... Who are those 2 firms ? ------------------- Btw, sometime ago someone said this, I don't recall where (probably in a telegram group): "Whistle blower on The Funded Trader. They own 1. Top tier trader 2. Leveled up society 3. Fortunes funding 4. Secure the bag funding 5. Rocket 21 challenge 6. Smart prop trader Using these small firms to create a large pool...
I don't know. TBH TFT is so insignificant as a company due to its nature it is inevitable to collapse. They seem to be the model that a lot of new firms are taking.

But lets be real here, are people actually signing up for "secure the bag funding" and "Fortunes funding".

FTMO itself is very well run and they keep their info to themselves, they do not seek outside help and none of the people I have spoken to in the liquidity space have a clue about where they are working. If at all, or even if their server is theirs or not.

There is one thing I wanted to add as well on the MFFX topic as its hilarious. He said regulation is likely to be light based on his genius lawyers. Apparently those lawyers are his age as well and werent around to feel the effects of dodd frank, im sure pipmaster knows what I mean.

If for some reason the SEC/CFTC decides that prop firms should fall under the regulatory guidelines then the regulation will assume that consumers do not have the mental capacity to make decisions for themselves. Which means the biggest prop market disappears in a day. To say that you think US regulators will be "light" is quite stupid and poorly thought out. But its par for the course.
  • #16,354
  • Jun 4, 2023 11:53am Jun 4, 2023 11:53am
Quoting Takisd
{quote} FTMO is not one of the 2 firms. The other firms, in my not so humble opinion, do not have the mental capacity to even realise what the issue is. For those watching at home, the issue is what to do with the order flow. Anyone just saying A book or B book doesn't understand the problem at all.
My current information so far:

MFF's Josh saying they are executing 25 bln dollar volume per day.
FTMO too must be doing something, I guess.
TFT's Angelo saying it is a billion dollar question, they want to become data company like Citadel, I think they are looking for someone to hire or hired already.

Are those two, MFF and E8?
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  • #16,355
  • Jun 4, 2023 11:57am Jun 4, 2023 11:57am
Quoting Takisd
This aint nothin but a summer Jam. I text from the beach! Happy summer. MFFX ceo is a kid. I dont think he means harm but he clearly doesnt know anything about forex, brokers, risk or risk management as an institution. The newbies are lapping it up but it wont last long as........ low and behold the slippage complaints appear. 8cap strikes again. Its a bit rich when a 26 yr old with a low cost solution changes a few rules then talks about revolutionizing the market place. He talks about being first at things, but i remember Funding talent and MFF...
I have tried well over 10 prop firms incl. the top 5 of course and even some others never mentioned here.

MFFX was the only one which paid me several times, without ever trying to f*ck with me, without any technical or other issues on their accounts.

All they do might be just a clever marketing and they may not survive the next winter. Their CEO might be a kid not able to trade, their broker might be the worst on the planet. But it doesn't change anything on my own experience with them vs everyone else.

The only prop firm which might be better is FXIFY. Only time will tell if they really are or not.

Enjoy the beach!
Money is made by sitting, not trading
  • #16,356
  • Jun 4, 2023 11:58am Jun 4, 2023 11:58am
Quoting Takisd
{quote} e8, rebel, t4t, tff, bespoke (EW yuck) and any other copy cat that appears i will likely purchase. Prop firms have become a game for me, i dont trade seriously with them anymore as its no longer necessary for me to do so. FTMO and MFF i pay more attention to in terms of risk and such but basically I test anyone who yaps a lot in social media and any one that people talk a lot about in here. I dodged Myfundedfx because its just eightcap again. It doesnt matter what rules you change as long as its 8cap its crap, they can pay me for the slogan...
Thanks. I never looked into TFF. I just glanced quick, I am very impressed by its site showing all paid traders account stats and their detailed trading history..
I will open an account with them next.
  • #16,357
  • Jun 4, 2023 12:07pm Jun 4, 2023 12:07pm
Quoting Takisd
{quote}FTMO itself is very well run and they keep their info to themselves, they do not seek outside help and none of the people I have spoken to in the liquidity space have a clue about where they are working. If at all, or even if their server is theirs or not.
What a typical Czech way of running business
Money is made by sitting, not trading
  • #16,358
  • Jun 4, 2023 12:08pm Jun 4, 2023 12:08pm
Quoting Boulder
{quote} Thanks. I never looked into TFF. I just glanced quick, I am very impressed by its site showing all paid traders account stats and their detailed trading history.. I will open an account with them next.
TFF seem to have problems when you go to withdraw too much I learned it early so i do not withdraw much. 4 figures or less only.
  • #16,359
  • Jun 4, 2023 12:08pm Jun 4, 2023 12:08pm
Quoting Boulder
{quote} Thanks. I never looked into TFF. I just glanced quick, I am very impressed by its site showing all paid traders account stats and their detailed trading history.. I will open an account with them next.
Too late to join them I'd say. They're not what they used to be anymore
Money is made by sitting, not trading
  • #16,360
  • Jun 4, 2023 12:12pm Jun 4, 2023 12:12pm
Quoting solarpower
{quote} My current information so far: MFF's Josh saying they are executing 25 bln dollar volume per day. FTMO too must be doing something, I guess. TFT's Angelo saying it is a billion dollar question, they want to become data company like Citadel, I think they are looking for someone to hire or hired already. Are those two, MFF and E8? {image}
I can tell you there are two people in MFF with more experience than me in FX.

Based on what Angelo says, what Matt says, what Josh says and what Jessica said it is clear who knows what they are doing and who doesn't. The fact that MFFX CEO talks about selecting accounts to A-book as if its like counting eggs from a hen house shows that he truly is not a fox. Even brokers, lets say ICMarkets, don't use an STP model because its the least efficient.

Citidel? please, no one is going to pay you for your retail FX data with retail spreads. If you had a 2 pip eur/usd spread, maybe they would feel that your data and your margin is worth something.

Nope the answer to the execution question is far beyond what currently exists by any firm in prop and even retail FX. It will require true innovation and knowledge, unfortunately, knowledge I do not have or i would solve that problem and laugh all the way to the crypto ATM.
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