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  • #11,921
  • Oct 30, 2022 8:01am Oct 30, 2022 8:01am
Can anyone identify any other firms apart from Funded Trading Plus that has static overall drawdown? FTP looks reasonable apart from the 1:30 leverage. Otherwise appear to have a bit going from them, i.e. no news restrictions etc.
  • #11,922
  • Oct 30, 2022 8:44am Oct 30, 2022 8:44am
Quoting timster
Can anyone identify any other firms apart from Funded Trading Plus that has static overall drawdown? FTP looks reasonable apart from the 1:30 leverage. Otherwise appear to have a bit going from them, i.e. no news restrictions etc.

Static is in the % value or static as in the % value off initial account size? If its the latter, its most accounts.
  • #11,923
  • Oct 30, 2022 8:44am Oct 30, 2022 8:44am
Quoting forexbali
I finished my table to have a clear idea and view of all the programs. I added The Prop Trading just in case get better there.... The worse programs: - ThePropTrading for the recent bad reviews - Fidelcrest: MT4 only and 10% phase 1 and even 2 to pass. Who can do better: E8 adding soon MT5 (already advertised in their website) FTUK: adding soon MT5 (this weekend they said and also tradingview access) Programs that are however interesting and less people speak of: The5ers, CityTradersImperium, SurgeTrader The best I like: 1. Funded Trading Plus 2....
A great job indeed! Another view on the firms we discuss here with all the key parameters summarized in one sheet - thank you!

Let me just share a few comments to the table contents:

True Forex Funds
- you can merge 2x 200k accounts to 400k (max initial balance)
- scale up (max AUM) is unlimited

E8funding (E8)
- you can merge 250k and 50k for example into 300k account (max initial balance)
- scale up is up until 1M
- every two weeks all generated profit adds to your balance
- the scale up of E8 is actually much better than that of ELEV8 as you have no required profit target. Whatever profit you earn that adds to your balance. With ELEV8 when you don't reach the target, ie. even if you earn 15.9% in 30 days, your balance remains the same and you have to keep trying without any scale up. The only benefit of ELEV8 is the 90:10 profit split which you get when you earn 3x 16% within 30 days each (!!)
- they also support crypto payouts (via Coinbase)

FTMO
- you can merge 2x 200k accounts to 400k (max initial balance)

My Forex Funds (Evaluation)
- scale up (max AUM) is limited to 2M
Money is made by sitting, not trading
  • #11,924
  • Oct 30, 2022 9:20am Oct 30, 2022 9:20am
Quoting forexbali
I finished my table to have a clear idea and view of all the programs. I added The Prop Trading just in case get better there.... The worse programs: - ThePropTrading for the recent bad reviews - Fidelcrest: MT4 only and 10% phase 1 and even 2 to pass. Who can do better: E8 adding soon MT5 (already advertised in their website) FTUK: adding soon MT5 (this weekend they said and also tradingview access) Programs that are however interesting and less people speak of: The5ers, CityTradersImperium, SurgeTrader The best I like: 1. Funded Trading Plus 2....
Quality work.

There are quite a lot of different props now, but is there any point in even paying attention to others until you have realized your full potential with the best of them? MFF, FTMO, TFF, E8, TFTP.

If you are looking for your first prop firm, I would recommend MFF because of the better target/drawdown ratio. TFFs are also interesting because of the 4% second stage. In addition, these firms have a reputation, a high profitshare ratio and fair rules for the trader.

Also I want to add an important information about Funded Trading Plus, which is an absolute NO GO factor for me. They love the trailing drawdown principle, and even worse, they fix the drawdown at the level of the initial deposit when you earn an amount equal to the initial drawdown. I can't imagine a worse rule for a trader who passed the challenge. You can't even withdraw all the earned profit or you will lose your account in the same second!
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  • #11,925
  • Oct 30, 2022 10:19am Oct 30, 2022 10:19am
An update on my case

Some of my buddys went to the TPT discord to question regarding the improper denial of profits relating to never existing rules, and they were instantly banned.

An absolutely hilarious way to approach this. I strongly urge the leaders of this forum to black list TPT such that no other people lose their money again.
  • #11,926
  • Oct 30, 2022 10:59am Oct 30, 2022 10:59am
Quoting Capablanca
{quote} Good work compiling info. You will probably want a flag in the map to show if the max loss is trailing or static. SurgeTrader for example is trailing max loss.
I know about what you are saying,

I verified with ALL the prop firm that:

1. if your initial balance is 100.000 for example and max loss is 10% the stop out is at 90.000
2. That if you make for example a profit of 30.000 your new stop out is locked to 100.000 AT LEAST
3. If you have generate let's say 30.000 profit, and you got a day stop out, they will pay you however the profit left, even if account terminated.

While some prop, doesn't lock in, just leave it to 90.000

So in my mind I keep just my risk to IB initial balance.

But yes better to do a column with this.

Now, for what you remember, which broker doesn't lock at least to initial balance the stop out level if you go in profit let's say of at least 15-20%?

For what I remember nobody.

But, just yesterday I was looking again The Prop Trading rules, if I understood well, if for example you have 30.000 profit accumulated, and
you got stopped out daily 5%, they will not pay you at all!!!! so they will take all your profits. This is insane if true.

So yes, let's do this last job,

which are the prop firms at risk that:

1. They don't trail the total stop to IB initial balance and they keep to the -10% stop level
2. The trail to IB
3. That if they trail or not, when there is a daily stop out, they don't pay you your profits accumulated (SCAM).

Are you agree with my poll?
in holiday till end of November
  • #11,927
  • Oct 30, 2022 11:08am Oct 30, 2022 11:08am
Quoting Vitore
{quote} A great job indeed! Another view on the firms we discuss here with all the key parameters summarized in one sheet - thank you! Let me just share a few comments to the table contents: True Forex Funds - you can merge 2x 200k accounts to 400k (max initial balance) - scale up (max AUM) is unlimited E8funding (E8) - you can merge 250k and 50k for example into 300k account (max initial balance) - scale up is up until 1M - every two weeks all generated profit adds to your balance - the scale up of E8 is actually much better than that of ELEV8...
Thank you for the collaboration!!!!!!!
All updated: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets...it?usp=sharing
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in holiday till end of November
  • #11,928
  • Oct 30, 2022 11:22am Oct 30, 2022 11:22am
Quoting Nihi
{quote} Quality work. There are quite a lot of different props now, but is there any point in even paying attention to others until you have realized your full potential with the best of them? MFF, FTMO, TFF, E8, TFTP. If you are looking for your first prop firm, I would recommend MFF because of the better target/drawdown ratio. TFFs are also interesting because of the 4% second stage. In addition, these firms have a reputation, a high profitshare ratio and fair rules for the trader. Also I want to add an important information about Funded Trading...
Agree with you about the best prop firm

about the rule of The Funded Trading Plus, thank you to highlight it!

I think is not done to scam the traders but they want to trail to IB because will be more profitable for the long term to don't lose that 10% to gamblers.

This is in exchange of NO LIMITS days they have without worry to make the target in 30-35 days.

But again, this can be an issue! you raised a very INTELLIGENT point on the rule.

It is not a dramatic one, in few words, your 6% profit in the example better stay there as buffer till you close one day your account.

However, view it in another way.

1. If I have an account of 100K, and initially stop out at 90k, and after a profit arriving at 106K balance I got the 100K locked IB stop out point (will not move from there), my goal have to be to arrive to a balance of at least 125K to get a total loss of 20% ...
So however I WANT to have that buffer, to get more risk.

2. Don't forget (sorry I'm a new member) that The Trading Funded Plus is the unique program where you can ask to eliminate the daily STOP!
Another BIG point for them. This is amazing for us. We can have at 125K easily a 10% drawdown with no problem to get terminated, and it's no risk for them.

This make for me the The Trading Funded Plus the best program around. That make me happy and the same time worried because the next
step would be to trade, the most difficult part, to survive to all of them in the long term.

Thanks however to remember to everybody the rules!
in holiday till end of November
  • #11,929
  • Oct 30, 2022 11:23am Oct 30, 2022 11:23am
Anyone tried FPF?

https://forexpropfirm.com/program

Evaluations are quite cheap and there are payout proofs - I think

There is no daily drawdown limit only 12% max DD limit

Only downside is stop loss rule and only 1:10 leverage
  • #11,930
  • Oct 30, 2022 11:25am Oct 30, 2022 11:25am
Quoting OranJuice
An update on my case Some of my buddys went to the TPT discord to question regarding the improper denial of profits relating to never existing rules, and they were instantly banned. An absolutely hilarious way to approach this. I strongly urge the leaders of this forum to black list TPT such that no other people lose their money again.

This is very serious! Even for my google sheets table and file I WANT BAN THEM if they are going out of business or they are so violent banning people.

We can't tolerate this. I'm new member, you know who is the moderator and who can help all the group on this.

This is a limit from to be a rule because a way to scam trader hard earned profit and also his life, because nobody want and can give for free months of his life in exchange of similar behavious.

Please investigate! The Prop Trading Firm is a big issue right now and I noticed that they changed website with lots of Spanish, so they are going maybe to target more foreigners less english speaking, with their business, that at some point would mean: no profits paid out.
in holiday till end of November
  • #11,931
  • Oct 30, 2022 11:34am Oct 30, 2022 11:34am
Quoting forexbali
{quote} This is very serious! Even for my google sheets table and file I WANT BAN THEM if they are going out of business or they are so violent banning people. We can't tolerate this. I'm new member, you know who is the moderator and who can help all the group on this. This is a limit from to be a rule because a way to scam trader hard earned profit and also his life, because nobody want and can give for free months of his life in exchange of similar behavious. Please investigate! The Prop Trading Firm is a big issue right now and I noticed that...
I agree with that sentiment. It is our moral obligation to alert others such that they also dont fall into the same pitfal of being scammed.

Anyone senior here on this forum knows who handles the blacklisting of prop firms or similar?
  • #11,932
  • Oct 30, 2022 11:37am Oct 30, 2022 11:37am
Quoting timster
Can anyone identify any other firms apart from Funded Trading Plus that has static overall drawdown? FTP looks reasonable apart from the 1:30 leverage. Otherwise appear to have a bit going from them, i.e. no news restrictions etc.
Daily drawdown allowed is only 3%?

Sorry but that is going to set up traders to fail sooner or later
  • #11,933
  • Oct 30, 2022 11:38am Oct 30, 2022 11:38am
Quoting Vitore
{quote} A great job indeed! Another view on the firms we discuss here with all the key parameters summarized in one sheet - thank you! Let me just share a few comments to the table contents: True Forex Funds - you can merge 2x 200k accounts to 400k (max initial balance) - scale up (max AUM) is unlimited E8funding (E8) - you can merge 250k and 50k for example into 300k account (max initial balance) - scale up is up until 1M - every two weeks all generated profit adds to your balance - the scale up of E8 is actually much better than that of ELEV8...
Thank you Vitore, your help was great.

It seem you know well E8Funding and the good news is that soon they will add MT5 while, because a prop liquidity, I don't think they will add TradingView access
but I asked them to answer about it.

Again, what you wrote is very interesting to remember, let me see if I understood well:

1. ELEV8 account 16% profit in 30 days, is above the average of for example 10% of some other prop.
Also to achieve even a 13-14% and don't get it is sad.
The best rule should be ok you didn't get 16% profit for a double up, but we can raise of 0.25 the balance if you made at least a 5 or 10%,
or give 3M limit for this 16%
2 E8 account: I missed out this scaling, and I will add now soon in my google sheet
If I understood correctly: if I have a 250K account, and I make 10% profit, I make 25K, total balance 275K
Now I can decide to withdraw my profits, let's say all 25K (80-20), new balance is 250K
Then E8funding raise your initial balance of 10%, so you will continue to take with 275K

is this correct? their website is not clear
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in holiday till end of November
  • #11,934
  • Oct 30, 2022 11:40am Oct 30, 2022 11:40am
Quoting Bizziebee
{quote} Daily drawdown allowed is only 3%? Sorry but that is going to set up traders to fail sooner or later
Is only 3% in the experience program (1 step challenge)

If you choose the advanced (2 step challenge), is 5%

3% because is one step program... just trade at beginning like you had half size, and you will make it like 6% ... then as you have a buffer however that 3% will disappear, because you can ask to eliminate it! that is the great of them.
in holiday till end of November
  • #11,935
  • Oct 30, 2022 12:00pm Oct 30, 2022 12:00pm
Quoting Nihi
{quote} Quality work. There are quite a lot of different props now, but is there any point in even paying attention to others until you have realized your full potential with the best of them? MFF, FTMO, TFF, E8, TFTP. If you are looking for your first prop firm, I would recommend MFF because of the better target/drawdown ratio. TFFs are also interesting because of the 4% second stage. In addition, these firms have a reputation, a high profitshare ratio and fair rules for the trader. Also I want to add an important information about Funded Trading...
I agree with this ENTIRE post 1000%. Those are my five as well. The other thing with Funded Trading Plus, when you scale, your DD stays the same as well....pass a 100K, have 10K DD, scale to 200K, you stay at 10K DD. I trade all of these firms based on DD allowed, so what is the point of scaling there, now instead of 10%DD you're at 5% DD???????WTF
Football time.......
  • #11,936
  • Oct 30, 2022 1:26pm Oct 30, 2022 1:26pm
Quoting forexbali
{quote}1. ELEV8 account 16% profit in 30 days, is above the average of for example 10% of some other prop.{image}
Yes it is way above average. It is much faster but much riskier as well. Here you have to earn 16% in 30 days vs. others asking for about 10% but in 3-4 months so in average it is only about 2.5% in 30 days. So in order to scale the ELEV8 account at all you must generate nearly 7 times higher profit in 30 days than with other companies.

I think they want traders to fall for the illusion of a very fast scale up whereas their own other account type (E8) let you scale up in almost the same pace. You start with 2.5x higher balance for just a slightly higher fee ($988 vs $888, and don't forget about the 10% discount available for both), and if you generate 16% each month you achieve the 1M account in the same time as with ELEV8. And even if you generate less than that, say only 4% each month, you still get there eventually, unlike with the ELEV8 which stays at 100k all the time in such a case.

Quoting forexbali
{quote}2 E8 account: I missed out this scaling, and I will add now soon in my google sheet If I understood correctly: if I have a 250K account, and I make 10% profit, I make 25K, total balance 275K Now I can decide to withdraw my profits, let's say all 25K (80-20), new balance is 250K Then E8funding raise your initial balance of 10%, so you will continue to take with 275K is this correct? their website is not clear {image}
Yes it works exactly like that. And the scale up can take place with every profit split - ie. biweekly. So you can take advantage of the faster compounding effect as well
Money is made by sitting, not trading
  • #11,937
  • Edited 2:04pm Oct 30, 2022 1:44pm | Edited 2:04pm
Quoting pipmaster77
{quote}The other thing with Funded Trading Plus, when you scale, your DD stays the same as well....pass a 100K, have 10K DD, scale to 200K, you stay at 10K DD. I trade all of these firms based on DD allowed, so what is the point of scaling there, now instead of 10%DD you're at 5% DD???????WTF Football time.......
With FT+ there's no point is "scaling up" in the traditional sense. Though they offer scaling up the account, there's no reason for it unless you need it for the margin purpose (see further below). It's all about building your own increasing DD by leaving part of the (or the whole) profit in the account.

Say you start with 100k. As soon as you reach 110k your DD equity limit is fixed forever at 100k. Now you have 10k of the total DD. You earn another 10% (balance is now 120k) and your total DD increases to 20k - as if your account was scaled up to 200k

If you keep leaving all the profit in the account you can "scale up" to whatever level you prefer (they claim they have no limit). Say up to the balance of 200k which means equivalent of 1M account with 10% total DD. (Here you may need to scale up the original account balance formally as the margin requirements might be too high for 1:30 leveraged 200k account traded like if it was 1M account)

Now you start taking all profits you make on every profit split, which means your DD (and virtual account size) remains the same.

When you decide, you can withdraw the other 100k from your account and it gets automatically closed. Or you withdraw 50k, reduce your virtual account down to 500k by doing it, and continue with this reduced account. Or whatever else.

It's a very different approach to scaling up (and back down if you please), which may attract some traders who don't look up for an immediate reward and want to control their total DD/virtual account size themselves

EDIT: I forgot about the most important benefit of FT+ which is the daily DD removal
As soon as you reach the 110k account balance from the above scenario, not only your total DD gets fixed at 100k level but your daily DD limit can be removed completely! (upon request)
From that very moment on you trade with only one limit - the total DD. Technically, you can use 99% of your total DD buffer during one single day and you're still allowed to keep trading...
Money is made by sitting, not trading
  • #11,938
  • Edited 5:03pm Oct 30, 2022 3:59pm | Edited 5:03pm
Quoting Bizziebee
Anyone tried FPF? https://forexpropfirm.com/program Evaluations are quite cheap and there are payout proofs - I think There is no daily drawdown limit only 12% max DD limit Only downside is stop loss rule and only 1:10 leverage

Even you can get there a free attempt if you open an account at a specific broker.

@masterrmind has there an account If I am not wrong. If you deposit 1300 dollar you get 100k evaluation account.



Very interesting mistake on their page: but as long you are trying to "cheat" the system, there should not be an issue

Max risk per asset is 1.5%. This is not nice if you want to go all-in at some point


--


I have read some review at trustpilot: Many complained about 1.5% risk per asset and hedging. You can't have a sell and a buy position at the same time. You have to put sl for 1.5% risk. Your account can be easily terminated due to this sl and hedging requirements.
  • #11,939
  • Oct 30, 2022 7:00pm Oct 30, 2022 7:00pm
Quoting timster
Can anyone identify any other firms apart from Funded Trading Plus that has static overall drawdown? FTP looks reasonable apart from the 1:30 leverage. Otherwise appear to have a bit going from them, i.e. no news restrictions etc.
-Traders With Edge has customizable options to remove daily draw-down completely and also have a fixed max draw-down that is based on the initial account balance and does not trail your profits.

Quoting Vitore
I forgot about the most important benefit of FT+ which is the daily DD removal As soon as you reach the 110k account balance from the above scenario, not only your total DD gets fixed at 100k level but your daily DD limit can be removed completely! (upon request) From that very moment on you trade with only one limit - the total DD. Technically, you can use 99% of your total DD buffer during one single day and you're still allowed to keep trading...
-Is this similar to Ment Funding, where you have to essentially build up your profit and keep it in the account to serve as the draw-down, thus completely protecting the firm in the process?
  • #11,940
  • Edited 7:50pm Oct 30, 2022 7:14pm | Edited 7:50pm
Quoting Vitore
{quote} Yes it is way above average. It is much faster but much riskier as well. Here you have to earn 16% in 30 days vs. others asking for about 10% but in 3-4 months so in average it is only about 2.5% in 30 days. So in order to scale the ELEV8 account at all you must generate nearly 7 times higher profit in 30 days than with other companies. I think they want traders to fall for the illusion of a very fast scale up whereas their own other account type (E8) let you scale up in almost the same pace. You start with 2.5x higher balance for just a...
thank you Vitore, continue to update my files with every of your words:

1. Where is this option of balance 2.5x with higher fee of 100$, I can't find it in website (fixed I understood now, see point 3)

2. I understood now the scale plan of E8, it is good and every 15 days basically

3. Elev8 target of 16% is very hard to reach. And if you think that E8 account is 250K vs 100K, doesn't make any sense.


I'm just comparing now their spread to 8cap.
in holiday till end of November
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