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  • #2,581
  • Jul 25, 2021 9:31am Jul 25, 2021 9:31am
Quoting Mtinifx
{quote} No he's talking about Myff I think. I picked up the mandatory SL rule on live accounts from the MYff thread. Also another rule is that you have to trade for a minimum of 10 days I looked on their website - doesn't say anything about trading rules on live account!

Only the rapid consistency rule model has anything remotely resembling a mandatory SL rule.
  • #2,582
  • Jul 25, 2021 9:34am Jul 25, 2021 9:34am
Quoting Takisd
{quote} Only the rapid consistency rule model has anything remotely resembling a mandatory SL rule.
Too many models. I cannot tell if it's MFF fault or just those that cannot decipher the different accounts they offer.
  • #2,583
  • Jul 25, 2021 9:36am Jul 25, 2021 9:36am
Quoting Mtinifx
{quote} No he's talking about Myff I think. I picked up the mandatory SL rule on live accounts from the MYff thread. Also another rule is that you have to trade for a minimum of 10 days I looked on their website - doesn't say anything about trading rules on live account!
Wrong again mate.... not on the Accelerated Emphatic or the Evaluation models, in the rapid I do not know
I had asked about this both times, it is not mandatory
Those who don't believe in magic will never find it
  • #2,584
  • Jul 25, 2021 10:03am Jul 25, 2021 10:03am
Quoting pipmaster77
{quote} IMO, the 400:1 is there to make folks lose the challenge quicker yet they tout it as a reason to charge higher fee, like it's a selling point. They must think they are dealing with amateurs, if they are trying to market to anyone in this thread..
i don t understand, how is higher leverage ruining traders? the higher the leverage the better? you just risk a certain % of ur account on any trade regardless of the leverage offered? on the other side of the coin, if the leverage is low kinda hinders u from taking multiple setups if they meet ur criteria etc? i keep seeing this as a trend about the leverage that is killing traders and i just don t understand..i mean..i know how the leverage is calculated and the margin required etc but..if 1 doesn t even know that then they shouldn t trade at all..let alone go for prop challenges.
any thoughts?
  • #2,585
  • Jul 25, 2021 10:15am Jul 25, 2021 10:15am
Quoting 1odi
{quote} i don t understand, how is higher leverage ruining traders? the higher the leverage the better? you just risk a certain % of ur account on any trade regardless of the leverage offered? on the other side of the coin, if the leverage is low kinda hinders u from taking multiple setups if they meet ur criteria etc? i keep seeing this as a trend about the leverage that is killing traders and i just don t understand..i mean..i know how the leverage is calculated and the margin required etc but..if 1 doesn t even know that then they shouldn t trade...
Sure, plenty of thoughts on this....
So I passed my last stage 2 with MFF without any leverage at all. I traded one standard lot on all trades on a 100K account Had 6 days of 1K+ and 2 small losing days, made the 5% mark in 8 days. With that being said..........
If you use 400:1 leverage on a 100K account, that is $4,000 per pip, your daily DD is $5,000....pretty self explanatory
If you use 100:1, it is $1,000/pip, stop loss better be less than 5
Even at 20:1, $200/pip, 25 pip move against you, you're done.
To me, the benefit of the prop firm is to trade much higher capital, so I do not need leverage or maybe 2 or 3 to 1 max. No more than 2 positions open, unless they are locked at break even or better. If I want to use 400:1 leverage, I'll throw a grand in a 500:1 broker and blow it that way instead.
  • #2,586
  • Jul 25, 2021 10:19am Jul 25, 2021 10:19am
Quoting pipmaster77
{quote} Sure, plenty of thoughts on this.... So I passed my last stage 2 with MFF without any leverage at all. I traded one standard lot on all trades on a 100K account Had 6 days of 1K+ and 2 small losing days, made the 5% mark in 8 days. With that being said.......... If you use 400:1 leverage on a 100K account, that is $4,000 per pip, your daily DD is $5,000....pretty self explanatory If you use 100:1, it is $1,000/pip, stop loss better be less than 5 Even at 20:1, $200/pip, 25 pip move against you, you're done. To me, the benefit of the prop...
i understand ur point of view, and congrats on passing the challenge, but...u simply measure the SL(pips) in % of balance, that easy, and u really don t care what the leverage is..not sure if i m managing to get the point accross. say i m buying GU and i want to risk 1% of my balance(whatever that is). then it doesn t matter if i go with a 5 pips SL or 50 pips SL, the risk on the stop is always going to be 1%!
  • #2,587
  • Jul 25, 2021 10:28am Jul 25, 2021 10:28am
Quoting pipmaster77
{quote} Too many models. I cannot tell if it's MFF fault or just those that cannot decipher the different accounts they offer.
in my discussion with them, they only kept rapid because it was their original model. But I dont know exactly.. I find the rapid model to be poop.
  • #2,588
  • Jul 25, 2021 10:29am Jul 25, 2021 10:29am
Quoting 1odi
{quote} i understand ur point of view, and congrats on passing the challenge, but...u simply measure the SL(pips) in % of balance, that easy, and u really don t care what the leverage is..not sure if i m managing to get the point accross. say i m buying GU and i want to risk 1% of my balance(whatever that is). then it doesn t matter if i go with a 5 pips SL or 50 pips SL, the risk on the stop is always going to be 1%!
Yes, absolutely correct, your leverage combined with your stop loss equals your risk. What I'm saying is to stay alive in this game, I recommend 0.5% risk per trade, but let's use 1%, so $1,000 on a 100K account......

we will even assume you are a super scalper and can use a 5 pip stop, so risking 1% with a 5 pip stop would be $200/pip, you only need 20:1 leverage for that.
I'll just stop there, because if your stop is any tighter than 5.....well good luck and if you wish to risk more than 1% per trade(personal account, fine, not a prop with a 5% daily limit)....you're going to have a hard time staying in the game.

So, that should sum it up as to why we do not need the ridiculously high leverage, it's just marketing.
  • #2,589
  • Jul 25, 2021 10:38am Jul 25, 2021 10:38am
Quoting pipmaster77
{quote} Yes, absolutely correct, your leverage combined with your stop loss equals your risk. What I'm saying is to stay alive in this game, I recommend 0.5% risk per trade, but let's use 1%, so $1,000 on a 100K account...... we will even assume you are a super scalper and can use a 5 pip stop, so risking 1% with a 5 pip stop would be $200/pip, you only need 20:1 leverage for that. I'll just stop there, because if your stop is any tighter than 5.....well good luck and if you wish to risk more than 1% per trade(personal account, fine, not a prop...
dude, it s not about how 1 trades or how small or large the SL is...is about keeping the risk in check calculating it in % of balance. doesn t matter if u use 1% or 0.5% or 0.1%. my point was about the leverage beeing a problem, and in my opinion it isn t. i do agree with you about risk management regarding challenges etc, but in general the lower the leverage is the tougher will be to make a ceratin amount in a well defined time table as the margin requirement kicks in if the leverage is low. anyways, just thought i d say this about leverage cos in my opinion is a common misconception and people are all concerned about how many lots to use on a 100k account for instance instead of looking at it from a % based aproach. cos at the end of the day they are requiring u to meet a certain %? the sl for me is nevet the same or the take profits etc, depends on the setups..on the pair i trade and on the ADR...i won t go in with a SL of 30 pips on a pair that moves 40 pips max in a day? just as an example. cheers
  • #2,590
  • Jul 25, 2021 10:49am Jul 25, 2021 10:49am
Can we make a poll or a list of the most trusted and legit prop firms?
  • #2,591
  • Jul 25, 2021 10:50am Jul 25, 2021 10:50am
Quoting 1odi
{quote} dude, it s not about how 1 trades or how small or large the SL is...is about keeping the risk in check calculating it in % of balance. doesn t matter if u use 1% or 0.5% or 0.1%. my point was about the leverage beeing a problem, and in my opinion it isn t. i do agree with you about risk management regarding challenges etc, but in general the lower the leverage is the tougher will be to make a ceratin amount in a well defined time table as the margin requirement kicks in if the leverage is low. anyways, just thought i d say this about leverage...
I didn't say it was a problem, I said it was not needed and is there to make people fail. The conversation started due to the newest offering charging more and using 400:1 leverage as a reason to charge more. What I am stating is simple, if you use even a small 5 pip stop and risk 1%, you only need 20:1 to do so. I wouldn't enter another trade until that one is locked, so another trade of the same, you need 40:1. I guess my risk tolerance is just much lower than some. Fair enough?
  • #2,592
  • Jul 25, 2021 10:58am Jul 25, 2021 10:58am
Quoting pipmaster77
{quote} I didn't say it was a problem, I said it was not needed and is there to make people fail. The conversation started due to the newest offering charging more and using 400:1 leverage as a reason to charge more. What I am stating is simple, if you use even a small 5 pip stop and risk 1%, you only need 20:1 to do so. I wouldn't enter another trade until that one is locked, so another trade of the same, you need 40:1. I guess my risk tolerance is just much lower than some. Fair enough?
agree with u on the risk management, the end goal should be to have a large account to trade with, cos the larger the amount the smaller the risk u need to take in order to make decent money..so it s not about getting rich quick.
  • #2,593
  • Jul 25, 2021 11:23am Jul 25, 2021 11:23am
My 2 cents on the leverage thing....

If a trader is "seriously" good, and "super" discipline, that type of leverage (400:1) may help, but not really needed

If a trader is part of the 95% that fail it is definitely an added negative and the final nail in the coffin
Those who don't believe in magic will never find it
  • #2,594
  • Jul 25, 2021 11:34am Jul 25, 2021 11:34am
Quoting pipmaster77
{quote} I didn't say it was a problem, I said it was not needed and is there to make people fail. The conversation started due to the newest offering charging more and using 400:1 leverage as a reason to charge more. What I am stating is simple, if you use even a small 5 pip stop and risk 1%, you only need 20:1 to do so. I wouldn't enter another trade until that one is locked, so another trade of the same, you need 40:1. I guess my risk tolerance is just much lower than some. Fair enough?
I personally don't need more than 1:30 either but there are situations where higher leverage comes useful without risking more than would be safe. E.g. when you swing trade instruments offered with low leverage (typically crypto may be as low as 1:2 with some brokers) which consumes most of your margin without risking so much, then you need high leverage even for a low volume scalping of currency pairs or metals in the same time with the remaining margin.
Money is made by sitting, not trading
  • #2,595
  • Edited 12:04pm Jul 25, 2021 11:49am | Edited 12:04pm
Quoting pipmaster77
{quote} Not eval, which is why I've been saying since the beginning, only model worth one's time and effort.
for evaluation and evaluation - live, one can not set stop loss less than 2 pips. This I have seen in MT4
Intraday only.
  • #2,596
  • Edited 12:21pm Jul 25, 2021 11:56am | Edited 12:21pm
I am advised by MFF. https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachmen...unknown-13.png if some one violates DD due to no stop loss, they will not get profit share.
Intraday only.
  • #2,597
  • Jul 25, 2021 12:01pm Jul 25, 2021 12:01pm
Also I am advised by MFF that for evaluation live, trading without stop loss is Big red flag.
Intraday only.
  • #2,598
  • Jul 25, 2021 12:12pm Jul 25, 2021 12:12pm
And they cautioned me... set stop loss for all trades.

As per rule, if i do not set stop loss for every trade, then for example, I make 10k profit and after that i violate.

The profit share will not be paid.

Our trades are watched by Robot.
Intraday only.
  • #2,599
  • Jul 25, 2021 12:21pm Jul 25, 2021 12:21pm
Quoting navk
for evaluation and evaluation - live, one can not set stop loss less than 2 pips. This I have seen in MT4
Since you've seen the same thing then it's confirmed a rule.
Know what you trade
  • #2,600
  • Jul 25, 2021 12:30pm Jul 25, 2021 12:30pm
Quoting navk
I am advised by MFF. https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachmen...unknown-13.png if some one violates DD due to no stop loss, they will not get profit share.
Share the entire rule please, if one violates the DD rule but is still in profit, they will be paid their share as long as stop losses were used. So only applicable if you violate account.
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